Drone Strike Peace Prize

0bama - a proud record holder of the president who bombed someone somewhere in the world... EVERY day of his ENTIRE 8-year reign...

iirc it was 2015,
something like 22,000 in both syria and iraq.
and he ran out of f**king bombs.

i may be off on the deets,but pretty sure i am close.

that too

False

He won the first DEI Nobel Prize for peace. He hadn’t been in office long enough before being nominated to accomplish anything worthy of receiving it.

He was just a DEI winner, not a deserving winner

You know B.O. didn't deserve that Nobel. Come on, now. Out with it! Or if you think he did deserve it tell me what he did to deserve it!

Barack Obama certainly didn't.

B.O. would bomb himself if that were the rubric...

90+% of Obummer Obomber's hits were innocents too. Obama getting that award--before he had done anything, before he started recklessly droning everywhere-- = style over substance at legendary Clown World levels.

Facts.

Definitely beats George Washington

I dunno why you think that's shocking or a "gotcha" thing. It's a lot like saying, "FDR built more tanks than any other president before him!!"

Because tanks hadn't been invented yet.

Okay, I'll re-write it. B.O. BOMBED more people than any president before him. Happy?

That doesn't sound accurate at all. What sources do you have that support this claim?

Are you refuting my claim by appeal to incredulity? If it doesn't sound accurate then you should be able to find a president who bombed more people easily. I'll give you a hint, it won't be Jimmy Carter.

You made the claim. Support your claim.

Saying, "do your own research" means you made it up.

So, either support your claim or admit you made it all up and it's a lie.

I didn't make it up. It's actually very easy to find and very well publicized. The problem is picking which one out of all these Google results... :-)

If you're not able to support your claim with facts... then it's made-up nonense. I

Either you made it up, or you were lied to by someone and you're repeating the lie.

If I made it up or was lied to then this is a lay-up for you. All you need is ONE president who bombed more people than Obama. You can do it, buddy! I believe in you!

Let's be clear about something: you are unable to support your claim. You didn't bother to actually look anything up. You blithely claimed "it's well publicized." But. You know it's not true.

It's a lie.

Let's bust out some facts!

Did you know that since 2007 the Department of Defense publishes the Airpower Summary? Yeah, it's a list of all the bombs we dropped. The number of missions flown. How many bombs were dropped. etc.

It's public knowledge. Literally. It's made available to the public. For free.

Well, not every year. Turns out the Trump Administration didn't report. Weird. Huh.

But we're in luck, the Biden Administration released those numbers. During the 4 years of the Trump Administration there were at total of 111,870 bombs dropped. Now, how many did the Obama Administration drop? 140,067 bombs

And you're probably like "CASE CLOSED!"

Hold on. That's 8 years of an Obama administration compared to 4 years of Trump. That's an apples to oranges kind of comparison. What if we compare the first 4 years of Obama to the 4 years of Trump?

That's Obama: 32,500. Trump: 111,870. You can do the math to figure out that 2nd Obama number but it's still less than Trump.

So, at this point, you're probably doing a "well...yeah...but...we have to compare the whole administration" or something similar.

I'm not done. You said any president.

On March 18th, 1969, President Nixon ordered Operation: Menu to begin. For the next 2 years, the USA dropped over 108,000 tons of bombs on the country of Cambodia. We don't know how many bombs were dropped. There were too many to count. We know that the Air Force flew over 3000 missions with double digit numbers of B-52s. Each one stuffed to max capacity with bombs.

For a country we weren't at war with.

Menu was followed by Freedom Deal. Where they escalated the bombing. (over 250,000 tons). On just Cambodia. Which doesn't include Operations: Patio, Pocket Money, Linebacker 1, and Linebacker 2. Those were limited to Vietnam. Over 7 million tons on Vietnam.

For comparison, for all of WW2 we dropped just over 2 million tons. In total. Around the world.

So... this "well publicized" thing? They lied to you.

Calling you out for not answering a simple question. Calling you out for not being able to fact check me properly. See my other comment. And by the way, "almost beating that number in half the time" means O-BOMB-A dropped more bombs. L.

I said stop answering questions I didn't ask. Now you're answering questions you ask instead? What the hell is wrong with you? You're not intelligent for answering 99 questions I didn't ask or that you asked yourself. You understand? Part of good argument is addressing the subject. "Tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth."

I ask you about Lincoln's assassination, I don't need an account of his presidency or a history of the Civil War. Shut the hell up. You're just a windbag. You know that? Frankly, it's kinda fruity. And you're not getting off the hook on this by saying "u mad, bro?" I'm calling you out is what I'm doing. Maybe you should think about why you're answering all kinds of questions that weren't asked.

Calling me out for what?

Pointing out that drone strikes were in their infancy when Obama took office so literally no President before him could have called more?

Pointing out that the guy who followed him almost beat that number in half the time?

Calling me out for showing that Nixon, in one f**king night, numerically ordered more bombs dropped than Obama or Trump did in 12 years?

Or are you mad that I pointed out that your "ahah, gotcha!" meme was dumb, unfounded, and clearly lacking any recent historical context let alone 20 century historical context.

I answered the 99 questions you should have asked before believing that nonsense.

Don't get mad at me for you being a sucker.

Bravo! Thanks for the information. So we may determine with a degree of certainty that O-bomb-a didn't drop the most bombs nor did he cause the most damage. However, he is one of the top bomb dropping presidents and therefore doesn't deserve the Nobel Prize that he actually got for nothing at the time (probably for not being W.)- all off the cuff comments aside. Nice job bringing the information on Nixon, again.

Hey, I just googled it and like 80% of the results had the name Obama in it. So that's what I meant by "well publicized." Maybe I should've said it SEEMED well-publicized. I didn't realize I was going to get a bunch of hedges on my answers INCLUDING FROM YOU. I didn't ask who dropped the most bombs in the first term. I asked who dropped the most bombs. Stop answering f**king questions I didn't ask, you dishonest f**k!!!

Are you mad?

You seem like you're mad.

Are you mad at me for using straight facts to show that you'd believed a lie?

Or are you mad at yourself for believing a lie?

I hope it's the 2nd one. Because i find this happens a lot on the Politics stream. Y'all want something to be true. You want to believe it so bad that when you get told something that fits that belief you accept it as fact.

No questions asked. No moment of hesitation.

Here's what I suggest: whenever you hear something that makes you say "oh, hell yeah, that has to be true!" then you stop. Say it outloud. Does it sound like a reasonable thing?

Then go verify some facts. Not a couple of google headlines. Go look up actual history. That's like 90% of it. Verify facts from primary sources.

It'll work out for you.

FINALLY, you answer the question. Nice work. It took too many posts but you did it. You gave me at the very least an estimate of the number of bombs Nixon dropped so we could hash out which president dropped the most bombs which was my question all along. That was it. I was willing to be wrong but I wanted to know which president beat out O-bomb-a and it sounds like you've answered that. Again, nice work. I cede the argument.

So, what I have from you right now is basically a wet bag of dicks to my argument. You admitted Obama dropped more bombs than Trump which pertains to the question I'm asking and you've admitted that you don't know how many bombs Nixon dropped. So how can you tell me he dropped more than Obama did?

You see, bombs could've been both heavier then and have smaller blasts back then. I doubt they would've been lighter and had bigger blasts because technology tends to move forward and that's not really the point of making a bomb to be dropped, especially in flight. Obama could've dropped a fraction of the tonnage of bombs that Nixon dropped AND caused more destruction AND have dropped more bombs in total all at the same time.

You haven't proven shit, my friend. You don't know shit. And you're not as smart as you clearly think you are. That's a problem with libs. Since you've infested the universities you tend to think you have most of the "intelligence real estate", let's call it, but actually you guys are pretty dumb and simplistic when it gets down to it.

The solution you tend to prescribe for everything is just throw money at it. It's like, "Uh no, you need accounting. You need follow-through. You need work. There's more to this than that..." That's someone like me coming in and asking too many questions. I ruined your whole plan, didn't I?

Let's cover this idea you have that somehow modern munitions have a bigger blast radius than bombs from the earlier eras.

What's the damage radius of the most common Vietnam era bomb? A standard Mk 82 bomb body produces a lethal area of approximately 80 m (across) by 30 m (along), giving a lethal area of approximately 2,400 m2. (meters squared)

What's the most common missile/bomb fired by a drone? It's the AGM-114 Hellfire.

What's the damage radius of the AGM-114 Hellfire? It's 15 m2. (meters squared)

You said you're a smart conservative. Which of those 2 numbers do you think is bigger?

2,400 or 15?

Which one do you think did more damage to the area and anyone standing close to that radius?

How many MK 82s could a B 52 carry? 108.

How many AGM-114 Hellfire missiles can a Reaper drone carry? 8.

What's the average weight of a Hellfire? It's 100 pounds.

I wonder how many tons of hellfires were fired? For a refresher: Obama ordered 140,067 bombs to be dropped/fired/etc.

Seems like that's a apples to apples answer you can come up with.

My plan was to point out that your "gotcha" post was more of a "um, yeah" post.

And I did that.

But you then you went on to show you didn't ask questions and went with "but he dropped more bombs!"

Which was also wrong.

But now you want to go with "well, could have been that bombs were heavier back then. And they could have caused less damage. Could have. Could have." Somehow during the Vietnam era the bombs were so heavy that fewer of them were dropped than the 8 years of drone strikes?

Okay, let's answer those questions.

What's the most common bomb dropped on Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia during the Vietnam War era? The Mark 82.

How much did it weigh? 500 lbs.

How many tons of bombs did the US drop Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia during the Vietnam War era? 7,000,000 tons.

How many pounds is a ton? 2000.

That's 14,000,000,000 pounds. What's 14,000,000,000 divided by 500 (the average weight of the most common bomb)?

Just take a moment and think about what that number would be. That's if every bomb was a Mark 82. For a refresher: Obama ordered 140,067 bombs to be dropped/fired/etc.

So... that's a lot more bombs by Nixon. A lot more.

We know that the MK 82 wasn't the only bomb type dropped. There was more than 1 type of bomb dropped in that era.

What's the 2nd most common bomb? The BLU-3.

How much did it weigh? 1.75 pounds.

How many could a B 52 carry at once? 10,000.

All it takes is 11 B 52s carrying a full load of BLU-3s to beat out Obama's number.

Could there have been more than 11 B 52s dropping full loads of the 2nd most common bomb over Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia?

Oh. Yes.

So, yeah, Nixon was the King-Daddy bomb dropper. Obama and Trump don't even rate an "also ran" because FDR had WW2, Truman had the end of WW2 and Korea. Johnson covered the first part of the Vietnam war.

Imma use a 2nd post to cover kill radius.

See my other comment, dickhead.

Since neither of you appear interested in verifying the claim, I went ahead and just did it.

The claim is true that Obama dropped more bombs than any other President.

It should be noted that the creation and use of drones, during Obama’s time in office, significantly increased the production and deployment of bombs.

And it should also be noted that both Obama and Bush were two term presidents and that Trump did exceed the record of most bombs dropped in a single year as well as dropped more bombs than any other President in his first term.

*We don’t have all the numbers from the W. Bush era but we can extrapolate an average and I will only count 2001-2008 (7 years, rather than 8 in fairness. He dropped about 6,598 bombs a year. I’ll even round that to 6,000 since it’s only an estimate.

W. Bush’s First Term: 18,000*
W. Bush’s Second Term: 25,196*
W. Bush’s Both Terms: 43,196*
Most Bombs dropped in single year: (2007) 6,906

Obama’s First Term: 18,892
Obama’s Second Term: 73,138
Obama’s Both Terms: 92,030 < validates claim
Most Bombs dropped in a single year: (2016) 32,080

Trump’s First Term: 74,984
Most Bombs dropped in a single year: (2017) 43,938

Source: https://247wallst.com/special-report/2022/03/05/the-number-of-weapons-the-us-released-every-year-since-2007/

These are too low. The DoD says that in 2017 we dropped 60,208 bombs but your source has it in the 30ks.

A nice powerpoint: https://www.afcent.af.mil/Portals/82/November%202021%20Airpower%20Summary_FINAL.pdf

Another source that uses the DoD numbers: https://progressive.org/latest/usa-bombs-drop-benjamin-davies-220112/

But Nixon far outclasses FDR, Truman, Bush I, II, Clinton, Obama, and Trump.

Thanks! I will look over these. I wonder what caused the discrepancy.

I was interested- but I wasn't really finding a straight answer on my results. I just wanted a straight "who did this" type thing. Everything was hedging in some way or another... kinda like you're doing here. I didn't ask IN THE FIRST TERM. I asked period. That's all. Everything including this is giving me too much information.

If you can’t handle the fact Trump dropped more bombs in the first term, according to these numbers, that’s your business.

You should take first term into account. After all, as these numbers seem to indicate, a President will likely drop more bombs in their second term.

And you can relax, these numbers are far from accurate giving the limited information I was able to find.

I still say trying to find information, even if inaccurate, is better than just petty speculative saber waving:

“nuh uh! You do the work”

“no you”

“no you”

The key is that when better information is presented, you don’t keep harping on inaccurate or incomplete information. My only agenda was to end the dumb stalemate. Lol. Which, I call that a success.

Have a good one!

PS. Argue better

You're way more invested in this than I am from all the research I got you to do. I didn't care in the first place and I proved it by having you idiots do all the footwork for me and I STILL WON! The fact that you're giving me more information than I asked for with this first term non-sense indicates that you can't handle how many bombs O-Bomb-a dropped. Not that I can't handle how many Trump dropped in his first term. I don't care about that. That's why I didn't ask.

And you can't conjecture about how many he would've dropped in his second term. It didn't happen. He could've become a pacifist in his second term. You don't know and yet you're here pissing on my leg and telling me it's raining. I'm asking a straight up question about what is, not hypotheticals. I don't deal with those unless it's necessary and here it is as far from necessary as it gets. Now get out of my face and bring your losses to other people.

The fact you need other people to do research for you doesn’t sound like winning to me.

In fact, I’m going to retract my statement and tell you that the new source that Whistlelock provided actually proves that Trump dropped more bombs in one term than Obama during both his terms.

It appears my initial source was older and less complete than his.

Oh, well. I guess your claim is wrong. Unless, of course, I’m lying but you can do the research yourself.

Let's consult Whistlelock's stats in real time here on bombs dropped:
Trump: 111,870
Obama: 140,067

Okay, now here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to compare those numbers and determine which one of those is bigger. Are you ready? Here we go. 140,067 > 111,870

AWWWWWW! You lost! Hahahaha, you can't even read numbers! HAHAHA! Why did you walk into this like this? You just embarrassed yourself in front of everybody. Here, I'm going to post your original post just in case you delete it out of embarrassment!

"The fact you need other people to do research for you doesn’t sound like winning to me.

In fact, I’m going to retract my statement and tell you that the new source that Whistlelock provided actually proves that Trump dropped more bombs in one term than Obama during both his terms.

It appears my initial source was older and less complete than his.

Oh, well. I guess your claim is wrong. Unless, of course, I’m lying but you can do the research yourself."

Oh god- if you weren't losing before you lost now!!!

“AWWWWWW! You lost!”

Did I?

According to your rules, getting other people to do the research for me means I win.

You played yourself.

No I didn't. I didn't say getting other people to do research means I won. I said I got a sock sniffer like you to do my research for me and I STILL WON. That means I won despite the disadvantage of you doing the research and therefore playing on your board. Learn to argue, bud. And listen closer for clues if at first you don't understand the rules lest you fall into another pitfall like this.

Oh! You think Trump not having two terms to do as much bomb droppings as Obama is winning?

Well, that’s a horse of a different color. And I can’t certainly argue with that.

We all won by having a bomb happy President for only a single term.

You should note, I have no idea how many bombs were dropped by previous Presidents.

I can only claim Obama dropped more than the loser in chief who shall only have the one term.

I personally don’t associate my wins vicariously through fanatical support of people who should serve us and not just themselves.

Someone who must only drag down others, and ignore basic contexts to prove a point while completely ignoring all the harm all Presidents can invoke, including your own, does not make either of us winners.

But we can guarantee these losers get only the one term. We let Obama, Bush, and Clinton escape. Trump stood no chance against We The People; and we could give Biden one term, but I refuse to let any ass who ran that Oval Office and our Country into the ground have a second shot.

How about you, loser?

Trump will have a second term. Deal with it.

Lol!