Mother Africa

Can you define the era of "the middle ages"? Like what years are you talking about?

The Middle Ages was between the fall of the Roman Empire and the Renaissance. Muslims owned slaves in Spain and maybe a few kings trading with the Muslims may have had a slave or two, but these would only be exceptions to the rule. In general European, Christian kings of the Middle Ages did not buy and sell slaves. All of this was well before the Atlantic slave trade.

Okay, a 1000 years spanning 450 AD up to 1450.

it's interesting that you exclude the Iberian peninsula. They're Europeans. You also add in the Muslim faith. They're also Europeans. And that you parse out that "a few rare exceptions" of Christians owning slaves. So, what you mean Northern Europeans from the French/Germanic area that also includes the British islands.

But bad news. They had slavery too.

Okay. The Visigoths were a germanic people. One of the Gothic tribes that migrated/settled in from the Balkans to the German/Franco/Iberian area by the 300s. That's when their conversion to Christianity began. They sacked Rome in 410. They were a powerful force in the region until the 900s.

They were European. Christian. And they had slaves. Until the 900s. They even wrote it down in their laws. See the Visigoth Code.

But that's just 1 group, right? No. There are others.

The Welsh also had slavery. The Cyfraith Hywel (medieval Welsh laws) only applied to Free Welsh Men, and specifically did not apply to slaves. You don't invent an entire code of laws, write them down, and specifically say "these don't apply to slaves" if you don't have slaves.

The Kingdoms of Moldavia and Wallachia had slavery until the 1400s. (That's modern day Romania region).

But we're not done.

Those White Christian Northern Europeans decided they needed to "free" Jerusalem from the people who lived there. Upon taking over, they inherited the local slaves. Along with the city of Acre. It was the largest city in the region. And it had an slave market that made tons and tons of money. They didn't shut it down. They kept it going. For centuries. It's from this era that the idea of "Christians can't own Christian slaves" comes into existence. It was fine to own non-Christians. But not Christians.

It was in the 1200s when Pope Gregory said, "hey, all these Muslims & Jews are converting to Christianity to get out of being slaves. You don't have to free them if you don't think it's sincere."

And if you're thinking "oh, but that happened in a different part of the world, NOT IN THE PHYSICAL AREA OF EUROPE!!!" That's a ridiculous level of parsing. Christian Kings and the Church fully endorsed and profited from slavery. Their proxies in the crusader kingdom owned and operated slave markets.

If you own slaves in Acre but live in Paris, you're still a slave owner.

Did I not say there were exceptions? Let me reword it. As a rule Christian, Middle Age Europe did not buy and sell slaves. By the time of the slave trade with Africa, slavery did not exist in Western Europe. Slave culture in the New World came from Africa where slave culture has existed continuously. The fact that most of the slaves were African proves this point. I am aware that some Native Americans in Latin America were held as slaves but this was the exception and has little to do with lands that would later become the USA. Is that clear enough? Shurley you understand that point I'm trying to make so please quit the shithouse lawyer routine.

Am I going to stop it?

No.

Because you're engaging in a fantasy that somehow White Christians were innocent of the idea, concept, and practice of slavery. That only contact with the evil Africans did they fall from grace and start the Atlantic slave trade.

Which, is frankly, laughable. You're trying to victim blame Black Americans for what happened to them.

Slavery in the Americas began in 1508 with the establishment of Puerto Rico. Ponce De Leon enslaved locals to build the port city. When they started dying off, Africans were brought in from Europe.

Columbus, you remember him, right? He was selling native Americans in Seville as slaves in the 1490s.

England, merry old England, didn't abolish snatching English chilidren off the street and forcing them to sing in choirs (as slaves) until 1602. You can read about the court case that ended the practice here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clifton_Star_Chamber_Case

You need to discard this fantasy that White Europeans didn't know anything about Slavery until they came in contact with Africans. Slavery was brought with the Europeans. It was part and parcel of their arrival.

How many white slaves or Indian slaves were there in Virginia, New York, South Carolina, Georgia, Delaware, Maryland, and the other 13 colonies? Where did "all" the slave in the original 13 colonies come from? The slave culture in the original 13 colonies came from Africa. Slavery has been practiced in many different forms all over the world since civilization began, but the slave culture that spread in the US was of African origin. African slave culture was continuous from Africa to the Americas. No other form of slavery became part of US culture.

It seems like you're referring to chattel slavery- where you can buy or sell another person, their children, and have total dominion over them up to and including killing them like you would a cow.

That's called chattel slavery.

The Romans and Greeks had it: https://oxfordre.com/classics/display/10.1093/acrefore/9780199381135.001.0001/acrefore-9780199381135-e-7311;jsessionid=967DB12DCE0962E314A220622B4D562B

Let's take another route: show me the historical evidence that chattel slavery was 1) unique to sub-Sahara Africa and 2) wasn't practiced by Europeans until the colonies were established in the Americas.