Illegal Invaders or Undocumented Residents?

Yes.

Terrorists and criminals slip in undetected and with blank passports. There is no logic in defending their stay here.

When you make a meme and the comment section turns into a political war section.

He'd be dancing on the button.

what about hispanics?
I am hispanic

I don't care if you are a purple three eyed frog legged alien from Venus, if you are illegal: teleport, if you are legal, have a cerveza.

It's not about ethnicity, it's about legality.

I already did... it's broken.

Wouldn't be ironic if you pushed this magic button and it teleported you back to your home ancestors. We're all illegals unless you one of the few indigenous people left.

No, that would only be ironic if I were illegal or descended from illegals. Furthermore, you are also wrong about "we're all illegals" as most Americans are descended from those who came in thru legal immigration channels. That indigenous people argument is ridiculous as most areas today are settled as they are as the result of war acquisitions.

Actually in the past immigration was very loose if at all enforced. Today the process to legally immigrate is exponentially much harder and expensive if it can be obtained at all. That said the natives here at the time got the short end of the stick any precursory study of history will tell you that. Anything else is rationalization. Not only do the spoils of war goes to the victors, but also the its claims upon history.

Like I said, your "only indigenous" argument is invalid because the precedent for defining who belongs where has been a product of war for almost all the countries of the world.

If you want to talk about power of course those who have the most power will have the most influence. That is how native lands were taken with many of them killed, raped, and displaced, by physical force and deceptive coercion.

But this does not make it moral nor just. If I am going to justify my actions because I can get away with it, and maybe I will in a sense in this world, then I'm quite the evil bastard deserving of all the karma coming to me.

What's sad is even when we think we are getting away with something we are really just cheating ourselves of a much more sublime experience. But that's another issue.

The truth is the truth. And the truth is the natives got a bad lot and from a moral perspective none us here are here legally.

But I do believe most of the natives here would have allowed us to stay anyway if we were willing to be helpful and peaceful. And that is the spirit we should have in kind when considering anyone wanting to immigrate here.

Freedom of movement is a good given right. Who are we to disallow it? The only exception I would make for this is if someone presents a real (not theoretically contrived) danger.

And the truth of the matter is most people coming here just want a better life. That's it.

Did the English get a bad deal in Normandy, did the Ainu get a bad deal in Japan? The fact remains, that's how the world is settled. Additionally, "moral" and "just" are not universal, but relative. And finally, wanting something does not give you the right to have it.

Funny how you put moral in quotes then turn around the very next sentence and make a proclamation about rights.

Why is it funny? Because you don't understand them either?

Like it or not (I know you don't) America has laws and those laws define who is here legally and who isn't.

Yes, whoever holds the power says what's what. But that doesn't make it true nor just.

It does make it true, whether you accept it or not. The only thing arguable is "just".

Among other things laws are subject to interpretation. But even if you could claim some sort of absolute, even though many on this subject could easily be argued, unjust laws are meant to be defied and subsequently changed.

AI will be a game-changer, however futurists have a bad track record of predicting impact and timeframes. "Computers will eliminate paper"....

Timeframes, societal compensations, impacts, etc, sure it's somewhat debatable; But no doubt it's coming....

I know you like to cite the Boston Tea Party in these situations. The Boston Tea Party was a hugely supported by the majority, if not in action and word then morally. Open borders does not enjoy that kind of support, not even close. But lets argue that it is unjust, and should happen, you are looking to all government social services becoming bankrupt and ending. Is that something you can live with?

Among other things you can have a much easier immigration process without necessarily open borders plus not have to give certain services for free.

Has your stance changed? I thought when we talked before you were for open borders. Or maybe I'm getting old. I have never argued against an easier process, but there does need to be A process, and away to insure that the defined process is followed. Immigration without assimilation only leads to internal factions.

Not only do believe in open borders but no borders at all, just like i believe in a sharing resourced based economy. Just like we need to learn to crawl before we stand and stand before we walk these transitions take time as well as bridges in-between.

I thought I had that right. You still have never explained how the resource based economy works when there will be those who feel like they are doing too much of the work while others are not pulling their weight.

In this case it’s tied to technology. By 2029 they’re predicting AIs as intelligent as human beings. Robotics are already off the hook. Plop an AI into a robotic body and it’s either a dystopian technocratic neofedualism or it’s a Star Trek like reality. Our choice. But we’d better fight for it now while we still have a chance. It’s coming *fast*

All illegals my ads. The natives did not live in a unified country with immigration laws. We broke no laws by coming here. We however, live in a nation bound by rule of law. We DO have laws regarding immigration, which these people are breaking. See the difference? Can't be illegal if you didn't break the law. Some day you peop me will learn that immigrant and illegal don't mean the same thing

I wonder just who needs to learn the difference between illegal and immigrant??? Regardless the law and it's applications means nothing if it is not just.

Your "just" and my "just" are quite likely to be two completely different things which is why it really boils down to a version of possession being 9/10 of the law. Which means we have to prevent the situation from occurring.

Your logic is self serving. If you were in another position, say that of the sanctuary seeker, you'd be most certainly sing and different *tune*

Your sanctuary seekers would have been killed as invaders in other times. The law is there, YOU are the one rationalizing excuses.

Actually I've got little to nothing to rationalize about. I'm not native American. I'm white of European decent. I'm just objectively calling as I see it. I also have a heart and empathy as did the native who helped out the starving colonists. It's too bad we can't be as understanding and generous of they were.

Autocorrect boggles my mind sometimes

Just sayin, why hold us to a different standard?

No, no different standard, mexican or javan, legal or illegal, same standard for everyone.