They don't deserve $4.50.

:0)

Asking for myself

So if somebody's European grandparents were separated at Ellis Island due to requirements at the time, their descendants are now owed $450,000 in reparations, right?

Asking for me.

If it happens, the discussion is limited to families affected by the family separation policy at the border. Not saying I support it, just pointing out out isn't an overarching policy.

Isn't an overarching policy "yet"

Ah, yes, the slippery slope. Their is no reason or motive to give immigrants money. It would be political suicide. Giving money to the kids who were separated from their parents...that has a purpose, even if I suspect the purpose is posturing.

450,000 tho? how much wealth distribution do you need?

Seems like a lot to me, but we are talking about kids taken from their parents, a failure to track those parents, and to return the children to their parents in a timely manner. Because they hadn't tracked, multiple deadlines set by courts were missed. I'm not sure what kind of emotional damage was done and how much help they might need. It is also up to 450,000 - I'm thinking that the actual payouts would vary.

Lastly, these payments are being considered in response to a couple of class action lawsuits, not just as arbitrary payments.

If such policies were applied and lawsuit precedents being established it would inevitably cause a boosted rush and unheard-of human tragedies at the southern border.
Quite an incentive for desperate migrants or unscrupulous human traffickers to jump the trek & jeopardize children in order to subsequently rake a $450,000 payment. They cannot be that stupid.

Trump's policy was to take kids away from their parents. It was intended to be punitive. There is no effort to pay money to the unaccompanied minors that arrived at the border. And again, it is worth noting that judges rejected the policy and ordered the children returned to their parents...but at that point parents had been deported without their kids and we had no way of finding them. So yeah...it isn't really as simple as you make it out to be.

And why does anyone try to settle out of court? We probably don't want international coverage of a trial where kids are interviewed about their experiences and how they haven't seen their parents in years. That would look bad.

Human trafficking settings are overly perilous. So putting children out of risk is for the benefit & safety of the children, it's definitely not "punitive". The Obama administration did way way worse.

http://www.wnd.com/2016/08/missing-child-w-spotlights-outrageous-obama-scam/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/obama-administration-placed-children-with-human-traffickers-report-says/2016/01/28/39465050-c542-11e5-9693-933a4d31bcc8_story.html

I don't like that the article doesn't source that 10,000 number. It makes it hard to verify, and therefore hard to trust.

10,000 released to non-family members doesn't mean it was all traffickers - could have been family friends or the like. Also, without a source, I don't know how they came up with that number. Were they not family at all? Are we sure, or did they just not fill out the form? Or was the form lost?

I'm not being difficult, these are just the questions I have when presented with a tidy number. But we know it happened at least a few times. Again though, was releasing children without background checks the process, or a mistake?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/failures-in-handling-unaccompanied-migrant-minors-have-led-to-trafficking/2016/01/26/c47de164-c138-11e5-9443-7074c3645405_story.html

It looks like the problem was people not following the policy, not that there was a policy to just give the kids to anyone. That's a tough one. For me it would depend on if it was a resource thing, or part of the UAM surge that happened and they let processes slide. If Obama knew that resources were needed and didn't provide them, then you could say this is his fault. If not...

I hear you. I'm not gonna argue those claims. I brought those up as a reminder that blaming-the-orangeman doesn't work ahead of 2017. And doesn't work in 2021.

Oh, agreed. Trump blaming Obama was similar. When he tried to blame the lack of PPE on Obama...bro, we are in year 3. I think you need to start taking responsibility for this stuff. Some stuff obviously does stem from the previous administration, but for the most part bringing it up serves nothing.

Alrighty then:
the blame-Trump-game doesn't work ahead of 2017. And is a cheap excuse in 2021.

So a human trafficker posed as the family of detained children to gain custody and they didn't catch it. That isn't an actual policy to separate children. And the separation policy was intended to deter asylum seekers. It was definitely punitive.

Did you even read the article?
10,000 children went missing - poof - gone during the Obama administration!
But, yeah- taking them away from traffickers posing as parents and putting them in foster care is to be condemned smh.

You do realize kids were separated because of human trafficking, right? Not to 'punish' illegals but to verify people were who they said they were.

No, it was referred to as a deterrent and as a zero tolerance policy. The ICE asylum chief said in February 2017 it was a policy under consideration to deter asylum seekers.

Jeff Sessions, 2018 "If people don’t want to be separated from their children, they should not bring them with them."

Yes- the Trump administration was tough on illegal immigration, and rightly so. Illegal immigration is not a pony ride. Nine months in the buck stops with Biden: what measures does this administration adopt to stop the border crisis? Other than playing the blame-Trump-game, halting the border wall, banning border patrol horses, flying a bunch of drones, watching surveillance footage in their cyber basements and throwing money at migrants?!

No one should be punished by default. Alas when people break laws adults are taken into custody/jail and their children are taken into foster. That's how it works: For Americans. For migrants.

So are you saying that you support the separation of minors from their parents at the border as a punitive measure or not?

Because you can be tough on immigration without that. As to the rest, walls can be climbed. Patrols in association with drones or aerostats to monitor would be much more effective given the size of the border to be monitored.

Border horses - that was knee jerk, no doubt.

Throwing money at them - a very specific case, not a general policy.

Also the damage from international media coverage is already done. The $450,000 headlines will fuel the caravan. As of now migrant numbers will rise more rapidly than gas prices.

The policy that led to child separation is done with. Whether that amount is warranted is debatable or if they should be paid any amount, but the idea that this will lead to more caravans is a stretch.

Those families and children should be taken care of by any means of accomodation, reunification and education it takes. Whereas throwing vaste amounts of money at them is insanity and will do nothing to resolve the border crisis. Quite the opposite; it will cause a rush. How do people not get this?

As previously mentioned, there are lawsuits going on. I believe the 'up to 450,000' per child may be part of a settlement. These specific children's stories have nothing to do with the border crisis going forward.

No it's not. You cannot just take child separation out of the bigger context which is illegal immigration, flows of caravans and border crisis.

Nobody is taking it out of context - but this is a mistake we made. I'm not arguing that the money is the proper way to handle it, only pointing out some details that are being omitted such as the limits on who qualifies, and why there is even discussion of paying them.

I believe that this is a good decision. Most illegal immigrants retreated from their country as refugees who need a new start

My family being political refugees from Cuba back in 1990 never got any money from tax payers to get a "new start", we worked hard and now are living the "American Dream" without being a burden to the people of the country. You must not be from United States or you must not pay USA taxes to speak such ignorance.

My family came here to escape mussolini, they were ran out of the place they settled in an "ethnic cleansing" and endured endless mockery and persecution for being Italian. They didn't bitch, they rolled with the punches, and thrived. Not a red cent from Uncle Sam, or our fellow man. God is good, and may HE bless america. Through it all, I was raised with the utmost respect for this nation, my home.

F**king based Italians.

Yeah, sorry, it's one of the pitfalls of allowing free will. But then again, He never promised life on Earth would be like in heaven.

AMEN!

Sounds like you're on the outside looking in. Anyone who supports abortion, as you have done throughout our conversations, isn't the kind of person who can comprehend the value of human life, much less attempt to comprehend the mind of God.

Fyi, HE's the only reason we escaped mussolini, escaped the bigots, and ended up thriving here. You would only see the trials, so focused in n them that you never behold the triumph.

Yes, I am the latter.

Yeah. Who wants to work without getting paid?