IT'S REALLY ABOUT NOT EURO-SLAVIC (European or Slavic)

THERE ARE TWO ASPECTS TO THE DEBATE:

1) NO country can have MOST of the people from A DIFFERENT CONTINENT (e.g., South America) suddenly show up at its border and just "accept" them.

2) BUT ... in the U.S. nowadays when people talk about "White", what most REALLY mean is "EUROPEAN or SLAVIC Ancestry".

They DON'T include in "White":

- Indian/Pakistani
- Arab
- Persian

But the FACT is that Indians/Pakistanis, Arabs, and Persians are NOT Black. They're NOT Hispanic. They're NOT Oriental. They're NOT Pacific Islanders. They're NOT Eskimo. They're NOT American Indian/Native American.

They're WHITE -- even though they're NOT from Europe or Slavic areas.

Most of the population of South America has NOT shown up at the border, nor attempted to.

That's not what I'm saying. The point is that it's an extreme amount--for example, 180k CAUGHT just in ONE month. As the comment says, there are TWO aspects.

The meme is about the RACE/ETHNICITY aspect. The COMMENT is that it's not REALLY "any White = Caucasian". You don't see complaints about Irish, Australian, British, Russian, Polish, Norwegian, Swedish, etc.

But awhile back I ran across photos of female students at some Iranian university. You wouldn't be able to tell that they're not from some place like Germany or Austria or Hungary. Absolutely typical Western Europe features--because THEY are Caucasian too.

Slavic countries/areas are in Europe, and thus European, unless you refer to Russia which had expanded eastward since the 18th century, although that territory is not considered Slavic, despite efforts to resttle Russians there.

Nope--genetically they're Caucasian, NOT Asian (Oriental). And English, German, Spanish, French, Russian, etc., are INDO-European languages. The Indo stands for INDIA. The ancient Indian language Sanskrit is related to LATIN. Farsi (Persian) is ALSO an Indo-European language, not an Asian language.

I actually thought folks from those areas were considered their own "type" (smokes that word sounds caustic)?

Regarding my use of the term "American Indian"--

Awhile back I read a book by an Emeritus Professor who is fully of "Native American" ancestry and who has done extensive research and writing about "Native American" culture, etc.

She said that a number of years ago A GROUP OF ACADEMICS with that background got together and said:

"GOING FORWARD, WHAT ARE WE GOING TO CALL OURSELVES IN THE PROFESSIONAL LITERATURE? (i.e., academic journals and books)

"The term 'Native American' has MORPHED and often is interpreted as 'was born in the United States'."

The consensus they reached was AMERICAN INDIAN.

Their reasoning was, "TECHNICALLY it's wrong because originally it referred to the Indian subcontinent. But everybody knows what it means and it's not ambiguous--so we'll use that."

I generally call myself a Native Person, only using Native American when referring to my ethnic group. Many consider the I-word to be a slur. Those who don't have Stockholm syndrome. Some younger Natives nowadays use the term ironically, spelling it N-D-N. The fact that the U.S. Government hasn't changed the names of the Bureau of I-word Affairs, I-word Health Service, I-word Education Service, etc. shows how much contempt this country still has for our continued existence.

I hadn't thought about this nor realized how important it is. Thank you.

What about using the correct tribe, like Navajo or Sioux. Indian in connection with any other word like native or American is still a throwback to the mistake made by the first explorers that had zero idea they were on an entirely different continent than where they thought they were.

:)

That's a lot of people on one train

Does "Indigenous American" work?

You can't make up your own terms. It has to be something that is GENERALLY ACCEPTED in the academic, professional, and governmental literature.

And the fact IS that words DO change meanings over time. When I was young (50's and 60's) "junkie" meant someone who SELLS illegal street drugs. It did NOT mean a USER. But over time the meaning changed.

When the term Native American was coined, THE meaning was regarding ethnicity. But now it's ambiguous. And in "official" literature using ambiguous terms doesn't work.

It doesn't matter what YOU call yourself. And, again, I'm reporting what a recognized scholar wrote--Ardy Sixkiller Clarke, PhD., Professor Emeritus at Montana State University and former Director of the Center for Bilingual/Multicultural Education there.

Dr. Clarke did NOT say, "This is the term *I* use." She said it's the term a group of scholars of that ethnicity agreed upon.

Regarding "Native Person" -- native to WHERE? If you are in Ireland people will realize you don't mean Irish? If you are in Canada people will realize you are NOT saying "I was born in Canada"? ( ... like Ted Cruz ...) (but I digress ...)

They needed a term that would be clearly understood by the academic community NO MATTER WHERE the reader was located.

When I write about the physics of how the universe started to how it got to where it is today, I use the terms "SCIENTIFIC cosmology" or "ASTRO-Cosmology", to distinguish it from MYTHOLOGICAL cosmology in religions and "origin of our people" stories.

"Scientific" and "Astro" are MY terms--NOBODY in the SCIENTIFIC community uses them. But then again, Astronomers/[Scientific] Cosmologists don't normally talk about religion and vice versa.

In things like my discussion above, I need to use terminology accepted by academics, or I need to provide an explanation for a term like "Euro-Slavic", which *I* made up.

I added a comment explaining why I said "American Indian/Native American" rather than just one, and that using the term "American Indian" is NOT considered racist, etc., among academics with such ethnicity and WHY they chose that term.

Does it matter what YOU call YOURself?

I realize this is getting a bit off topic, but here is some info on Dr. Clarke from Montana State University:

http://www.montana.edu/president/universitywomen/extraordinary/eow_profiles/clarke.html

I generally do not like any term that starts with American then the group because I see it as dividing us. But the Native Americans (I like Native Peoples myself, but that’s just me) I understand. There is a divide and that is America’s problem that has no easy answer.

I once read that getting more than six people to agree on where to eat dinner is an impossibility. Now add to that mix millions with sub groups each demanding their views being respected on not only where to eat, but what type of food, chain or independent restaurant, any number of things. So when it comes to a sub group complaining about how I should address them, I generally just go along with the individual I’m dealing with as it isn’t worth the fight.

Also I’m a Scottish American! Don’t call me (insert stupid name here)!

As I explained in my original comment--I'M not the one who said they needed a non-ambiguous term because "Native American" has become ambiguous. I was born in New York--so *I* am a "native American", not an immigrant--even though I'm strictly of European ancestry.

NOBODY is going to routinely distinguish between "native American" and "Native American." And when it's SPOKEN, there is no capitalization.

And THAT is the problem the group of American Indian/Native American scholars were addressing.

I understood your point, just making one of my own :)

As far as I care, skin color doesn't matter at all. My ancestors were Ukrainian, Croatian, and German. I'm proud of that and own mementos of each (shirts with flags, etc). But what makes me American is the fact my great-grandparents came here to escape WWII and build a new life.

Same chance should be offered to anyone willing to put in the work to become a legal citizen...once we fix that system...

Unfortunately, as I said the very first comment, there are TWO ASPECTS.

Sadly, to be blunt, the problem is NOT FIXABLE.

NO country can have MILLIONS of people who don't speak the language and have no "marketable job skills" "just show up" over a period of A FEW years and be "absorbed". That is NOT a POLITICAL issue.

ASIDE from that, everyone talks about "discrimination against non-WHITES". But they don't want to face the fact that Indians/Pakistanis, Arabs, Persians, etc., ARE Caucasians but when people talk about "White" they really DON'T include those ...

As the meme points out, it's really about "people who do not look like me."

ᏣᎳᎩᏍ ᎯᏬᏂᏍᎩ? So a country of millions can only have one language? Canadians might disagree.

I didn't know my phone could display Cherokee! That's f**kin' rad.

Oui

- So make learning basic English a requisite for citizenship then, if that's your beef. You do that and you have a functioning brain, you can work any fast food, retail, landscaping, or construction job around. They train on-site and you can absolutely use that as a way to live while taking more intensive education and laying the foundation for a career.

- Show me data that actually proves you face discrimination if you're Arabic or Indian...Not once have I, at least, ever heard that those demographics are disadvantaged in the job market. In fact, I've heard Microsoft and other big corps will boot employees in favor of migrant workers who will take less pay (that is only confirmed to be true anecdotally though and I welcome some data to support/dispute it on a grand scale).

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/think/amp/ncna1212051

And for what it's worth, it seems incredibly white-washy of you to call them white when they themselves may not necessarily prefer that designation. Legally they are, but I'm sure you're smart enough to realize the law isn't always right.

You know who learns English? The children of immigrants. I grew up in and around Tampa and there was a large Cuban population there and many did not speak English, but their kids I went to school with did. I later moved to New England were there was a very large Polish population. They had been settled longer and they all spoke English, but most also still spoke Polish as well. (I even got married in a Polish Club despite neither my wife or I being Polish,)

And remember the first permanent European settlement in America (named for an Italian) was Spanish (Saint Augustine)

I personally dislike the idea of making learning English mandatory. The melting pot of the world shouldn't have one official language. The only reason I suggested it was to see how Rick would respond.

Yes, as a Catholic and a history buff I've always wondered what America would be like if say, the Spanish Armada had toppled England and brought it under the Spanish crown. Would the entirety of North and South America speak Spanish today?

Alternative armchair history, yes, but that's always a fun way to spend some time.

Guessing you saw "The Man in the High Castle"..... if Hitler stayed out of Russia a few more years, we would all be speaking German.

Actually I've never watched anything beyond the scenes with beautiful animated models of ships like Yamato.

But speaking realistically, Germany had no chance of winning WWII.

they were working on the bomb before we were, if they didnt expend so many resources on Russia they would have had it first, they already had missiles and jet fighters, thank god hitler was a nutbag.

Oh their technology was advanced, that's for sure. Operation Paperclip existed for a reason. But we did beat them to the bomb, jet fighters and rocketry were being operated by the Allies to a lesser extent, and strategically Germany couldn't have applied these in such a way that he could have conquered the world outside of Europe and Africa/western Asia.

Indeed though, Hitler was his own worst enemy and we need to be grateful he made so many asinine decisions.

Forcing everyone to speak the same language is ethnocide.

I spoke to a Maasai tribesman on that subject. He was very clear that he expected his tribe to be educated in both Maa and English. He was the son of the chief, and because he would someday take over as chief, he had been sent to Oxford to get a degree in economics. He said that hundreds of tribal languages exist and the fact that most of the continent shared a common second language of English, provided a huge peace dividend and allowed many smaller tribes to survive and retain their own identity while simultaneously being a part of the larger community as well. It was difficult to not go to war with your neighbors if you could not communicate with them. The fact that he was wearing a headdress, covered in ochre and carried a spear was initially a bit of a hurdle for me to get past to understand the amazing person I was speaking to. I'm glad I put in the time to get to know him, and I'm thankful for the time he was willing to spend with me. I learned a lot from him about Africa, and in fact, the world.

Some cultures should be erased. *looks at Texas*