Don't forget #WindowLivesMatter y'all

The fact that a man was tortured to death by cops does not give people the right to destroy other people's property, and start looting...

We have a second amendment right to bare arms and use them when we are faced with tyranny. Yet, if we shoot bad cops, we get killed. What options are left to those who are oppressed when tyranny is left unchecked but to destroy the very property of those who remain silent when police kill their own.

No, I don't agree with it either but I understand the frustration and I think the cops are far worse than the looting or the property damage. Those businesses are insured. It's the insurance companies that are screwed. And I don't really give a f**k about them. But you know who do? Lawyers and politicians. F**k those guys too.

Frustration ok.... You don't need to tell ME what frustration is... And you also don't have to tell me what "tyranny" is.... Experience told me the meaning of those two words.... So you post is a major insult from the start!

But you know what.... The last thing you must do if you want to stand up against violence based on racism (as it looks like the Floyd case is a case in which this applies), is confirm the stuff racists say about you. The meme appears to suggest we should just take vandalism and looting as a legit side-effect of what happened to Floyd and many guys before him... And no that is not the case...

Oh, and did it come to your attention that cops have to act more aggressively when you know every civilian carries a gun? That is the backfire effect of that amendment... Also define "bad cop"... Rule #1 in gun fight is, that as soon as you cock your gun at somebody you give them the right to shoot back, this includes cops. They too have the right to defend themselves... But what if a cop doesn't have to defend himself against a gun? Although it's funny how the 2nd amendment keeps being brought up, as nothing reached my ears in the Floyd case on which the 2nd amendment could apply, but maybe they held back some information from me?

Fact remains... that whatever happende to Floyd, no matter if his death was just or plain murder, it does not justify breaking windows, looting and threatening the safety of others. And I don't care about their frustration... Frustration and life are synonymous to me, so I already know about about it. Justified as their frustration may be, I don't think those deeds are a response in frustration, but rather that the frustration is used as an excuse to do these things... And you know what pains me? That people who are frustrated and who've seen the psychiatrists office on the inside because of that are not taken seriously because of these things... And that makes me too a victim of prejudice as much as them... I only belong to a group who seldom gets attention by the media...

And by the way, insured or not, that is no excuse to break stuff down, and no not all those business are insured. Did you also know that insurance costs rise whenever stuff like this happens? And they can also put on more safety obligations on their customers. If this happens too much insurance companies will even refuse insurance against stuff like this. Narrow-minded to be bone...

You know nothing, Jon Snow! (And neither do your upvoters).

I'm glad I don't have to explain frustration.

The vandalism and looting isn't a side effect of George Floyd. It's a side of effect of over 200 years of oppression.

I agree that violence is not the answer but to sit there and say you wouldn't behave this way if you believed there were racists in positions of power who were given the benefit of the doubt by the Justice Department, the media, and society in general to kill you only if you "do not own a gun" or "behaved in a threatening manner" or "broke the law" that your reaction would be compliance.

Maybe it would be. Maybe you'd think... okay, I just have to be more careful. I got to raise my kids to be better. I got to prepare them for this world where they could be killed by police for being in the wrong neighborhood and the wrong time, for using a fake $20 bill, for trying to defend themselves from a home invader that's actual a SWAT team with a no-knock warrant that has THE WRONG F**KING HOUSE! Maybe you would do that. And a lot of them do. They shouldn't have to and everyone has a breaking point where I can honestly say, I get it.

And people who don't normally trust the media and don't trust the government; should get that too.

Your pain doesn't make their pain any less of an aggrievance.

Yes, I'm aware of insurance raises and how they work. But do you think I give a damn about that?

No... It's not a sign of 200 years of oppression. If it was, they wouldn't plunder property of people who are not involved at all.

Kill you only if you do not have a gun, eh? I live in one of the many countries where guns are outlawed, and although incidents like Floyd's still happen, they happen significantly less. As a matter of fact, it's very extremely rare, and the U.S. it appears to be a systematic issue? Of course, this is no solid evidence to anything, but something you should think about.

Okay, they had a warrant for the wrong house, now let's assume that to be the actual story, you gotta take a few things in mind. Errors like these can happen, and you can never rule them out for 100%. And now what would you do if you were a cop knowing everyone owns a gun? Would you dare to take the risk the suspect can fire at you?

The 2nd amendment discussion shows that weapons only lead to more weapons, and thus when things go wrong, more violence. Remember the "nuclear game"? I do! Oh, Russia has more nuclear weapons we do, so the US must have more... Oh, the US has more than Russia does, so now Russia needs more, and so things go on....

Not trusting the authorities ain't a bad thing. Nobody in their right mind trusts them, but yet, you can also put this too far. In the end authorities are needed, like it or not. Generally deeming everything the media tells a lie, unless it "confirms" what you believe is also not he right way to go. Things rarely happen the way people want to.

And no my pain doesn't ease their suffering. It only makes that I know what they are going through better than you can imagine, but that also makes that I know that what they do is wrong.

And that you don't care about insurances... You don't care about anything that matters, that much you made clear. Shows you are just a selfish git, trying to talk like a communist, a paradoxal combination. Insurance companies however play a great deal in the world economy, so making them pay needlessly, will make you and many others with you pay the price eventually. What if you were working for one of those businesses destroyed? Would you still feel safe at work?

You clearly ain't qualified to talk about matters like these. As a matter of fact, speech like yours will preserve the problem, in stead of solving it! And that is a fact, proven throughout the entire course of history, countless times.

More than the violence itself, the problem is even more that they vent on on those not involved.

The structure of the sentence was problematic. I meant to say: If you're armed, and black, and you're questioned by cops; you're dead. It doesn't matter if you committed no crime, do not have the gun in hand, or if you inform the cops you have a gun. It appears to many times to me that they will be shot. Maybe it's the same way for white people too, after all; they have a much higher fatality by police than black people and I wouldn't be surprised if more white people owned guns than black people.

Aaand, according to a brief glance at a 2017 pew research; yup. More white people own guns than black people. But correlation doesn't equal causation. This is just a hypothesis.

I wouldn't be a cop at all, honestly.

Defunding police is not the same thing as dismantling. And even if a police department is dismantled, it tends to get rebuilt from the ground up. I'm not saying we don't need police. I'm saying the call for accountability is justified. That the boiled over frustration of decades of repeatable offences are justified.

I agree that generalization is wrong and I agree that rioting and looting is wrong. You can find rioting and looting wrong and still understand why it happens.

Insurance is the least of my concerns doesn't mean I don't care about anything that matters. That is generalization and we just went over how that is wrong. No, I do not think I would feel safe working where my business was destroyed and I certainly would want those involved caught and reformed. But you're going to have to forgive my rather "reckless" bias for insurance companies. It is just my personal view that they are financial scams and while integral to our economic health; I am just not a fan of them. Saying that insurance will go up does not make me sympathetic for insurance companies. It, of course, makes me sympathetic for the businesses affected. But my blame is on the police brutality, not the people pushed to these extremes by years of oppression.

What I'm trying to say, if I'm saying anything... if you live carefully, knowing that just by the color of your skin that you might be more likely to get into an altercation in with a cop. That may end with you incarcerated or dead; and you know a man, an uncle, a cousin, a father, or a brother that this has happened to. And it keeps happening. I could see how that makes someone want to burn it down.

I just can't blame them for that. I'm sorry.

Whenever people start to speak in numbers, I know they lost their case. What are the numbers based upon? How do they come to be. Numbers are always used in debates in the way they come out best. Plus more white people with guns, tells little to nothing about a black guy not having one. It takes only 1 guy to kill a cop with a gun, black or white... So why bring that number up? Assuming by skin color the guy would be unarmed is just as racist as assuming he's a criminal.... See the racist loophole in your reasoning? Anti-racist activism is something not to think lightly about, as before you know it, you'll become what you wanted to destroy.

Now in the case of Floyd I hear more and more stories backed up with stuff, that would plead Floyd not a criminal, however these plunderings have also taken place when a black guy killed by the cops actually WAS a very brutal and dangerous criminal. Black people are not saints, you know. Neither are white people for that matter. In Floyd's case I cannot be fully sure if him being black was what doomed him in the cop's behavior, although it seems, based on many other cases, plausible.

Now I hate insurance companies too, but they have a function, and due to many cases of insurance fraud over time, they sometimes have to be jerks. Yet they are not paying just to give people the liberty to start destroying stuff. Now I've spoken with people running a business, since only a few businesses are multinationals, you know. Many shops you can find are small businesses and loads of people I know would be financially better off if they didn't own a business, but worked for a boss in stead. A lot of those can't even afford insurance. If then your business goes down, your life goes down. And when it comes to big companies... If I'd work for one and see my office destroyed like that, I think I'll apply for a job elsewhere. I'm not asking to sympathise with insurance companies, but you should note that insuranced or not, getting your business destroyed by people over a course you were not part is, is not something you wanna experience... If it costs you money or not. Some of the destroyed businesses might even have black owners who are just as frustrated as they are.

There are also people living in those neighborhoods fearing for their own lives and those of their families. Not to mention their properties. Insuranced or not, I'd hate to be in their shoes now. All insurance can cover is financial damage. But they cannot cure the trauma

I would not say numbers are a sign of a lost case. In math and science, they are essential and can show us a value in something.

I am thinking you’re missing my point that I believe the reason black people are less likely to own a gun than white people is because they fear that, even if they were not involved in any criminal activity, a cop will shoot them.

I’m not saying cops should assume black people are unarmed, I’m saying black people assume cops will kill them if they are.

I've heard the stories of innocent people falsely arrested for drugs crimes even from countries were cops are less infamous than in the U.S. and I can tell you that they were all traumatizing. Cops coming in, fully armed, not exactly being polite to you, ordering you around... People peed their pants for less, regardless of skin color. I'm not even sure Floyd realized that he could be in more trouble because he was black. Having a gun pointed at you, regardless of the fact its wielder is a cop or not, is a very threatening experience, and psychiatrists specialized in this field told me that you cannot underestimate that threat.

Fact remains though, that regardless of what happened to Floyd, people didn't get the right because of that to loot and vandalize. They were allowed to express their anger, their frustrations, and although it's not safe to assume Floyd was only treated worse than necessary only because he was black, we see this happen so often, that I cannot deny there's a pattern, either, and yeah, they are right in saying that has to stop. Now not to offend the U.S. anthem, but I'd rather see people protest by kneeling when the anthem is being played, than I see them vandalize other people's property and stealing their stuff. I mean offended as some people might have been by people kneeling when the anthem has been played, at least they did not get other people in trouble.

And that is my point all along. A man getting tortured by cops leading to his death, doesn't give others the right to destroy other people's property. Period. Being angry? Fine! Shout out in anger? Go head! Hold peaceful protest marches? Good! Spread your anger on social media? As long as you refrain from war propaganda... all good.... Just destroying people's property is not fine. And the picture above, suggests that we should not blame people for destroying other people's properly simply because there was a man tortured to death, and even suggests people angry about that do not care about that man. That is a bit of a bullshit statement. Both actions, as well as the way Floyd was killed, as the vandalizing that came after that, are inexcusable. Period.

Nobody ever affected real change with destruction and violence. Ask Gandhi.

Oh right, they vandalized his statue too.

Fair enough. I’ll add the caveat “since the bankers have taken over the world.” Most people miss that fact that all wars since Napoleon ran amok have been financed on both sides by the same people. Also I upvoted. Nice retort.

Here I have posted actual footage (actually, since cameras didn’t exist back then: artistic depictions) of two related events that took place in Boston in the 1770s

Do you recognize them?

Do they bear any similarity to what we’ve seen this year?

As long as we all think like that, nothing will work... Violence only makes things worse, and normal talk people don't wanna listen to....

After all, men has still not overgrown the tribal instinct of the time of cavemen. We (our tribe) must survive and they (the other tribe) are bad. Back then essential to survive in nature. Today we can no longer afford it, but we keep putting importance in "we" and "they". And who "we" is and who "they" is? That depends on who you ask... As long as people think in "we" and "they" nothing will help. I repeat nothing. Don't even dream about it.

But whenever I bring this up, I am suddenly the bad guy and you know why? Nobody likes to be lectured about the truth about themselves. And then the easy way goes... then I belong to the "they" group... the group who thinks beyond, and then the "we" is the group who doesn't like that...

In the end everybody is responsible for their own deeds. We've been living in accordance of this instinct for as long as mankind exists, and now people believe they can stop that in only a few decades? Also knowing that nobody likes to be lectured, and coming to the conclusion you may be judging others too easily even to the level it may be discrimmination, sometimes without realizing it, is not something people like to do, you know.

However using "evil" as retribution against "evil" is still "evil"... So I stand by my point!

But like I said... after thousands of years of discrimination on many fields, not only racism, I think it's beyond naive to believe you can stop this before the current generation dies, or even the next 10 generations for that matter. All you can do is make people aware, and also to mind your own contribution in all this, which is easily bigger than you want to believe. Some people began to do this.. that's a start, to a long way we have to travel.

Giving racists a reason to yell "See! I was right, they were criminals all along", is counter-productive, you gotta admit that. If this is ever gonna stop, it will take a looooong time.... I hate discrimination in all forms, but I am also a realist when it comes to these things!

Can you change the fact that evolution has fallen behind on the civilazation we're trying to create? As a matter of fact, you ask exactly that that I deemed naive in my previous comment. There is nothing you can do. This is something that has to fade away over time, no matter how much I hate to say that, but I'm afraid that is the only truth I can give.

Hating people of another group used to be an essential instinct for survival. In current days, we cannot afford to live by that instinct, but as evolution is always a matter of thousands, if not millions of years, you can imagine how much more years we'll need.

All you can do is keep people aware, and hopefully this will make other people see that, and that will take a very very long time.

Violence, plundering, shitting on great historical people, breaking down statues, and all that, can all be taken up as a provocation, and when you provoke people they will overall only be too happy to return the favor, and strengthen their believes, and also cause them to become just as violent in the end.

And people who truly hate, for the sake of hating, just following their cavemen instincts, are most often not willing to change their minds. Because stopping to hate, is admitting they've been wrong, and admitting they need to change themselves. This requires strength only a few people possess. However treating these people with violence, threats etc. will only make them hate more.

Now more and more people begin to see, this hatred is silly thing. That's a start. But in stead of wanting to change cultural things, like removing statues, and other things, we can best keep in mind that all cultures in the world have a history in blood and other things. Best is to accept the past the way it is. And to keep people aware of that past, oh yes, but not to let it be anything to be either proud of of be offended by. Most of these iconic people, either good or bad, were dead before our parents were born. Should we continue the arguments started by people who are all dead now?

Keeping people aware, and accept this issue won't go away during our livetimes, is the only way to go. This is rooted to deep to solve in a few decades. Accepting the other group with their pros and cons, and accepting our own mistakes of the past is all we can do. That goes for the other group as much as for ours, no matter which of the groups you belong to.

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We'll never know.... It is indeed possible that if it was somebody else in his place who died horribly that he could do this. Although, I've read the transcript of his final moments (or at least a Dutch translation of them, but I do have the original English version as well), and given what I read there, I honestly doubt he would...

Wow, you really had to bring up that he took meth,