Just because you are born somewhere does not make you that nationality.

Mohammed just needs to live in Sweden for five years and he's granted citizenship by naturalization. Quite frankly, he doesn't even have to speak Swedish, although if he was born there he probably does.

So, yeah, they really do consider him Swedish no problem.

Sure but he'll never be ethnically Swedish. Which is the point. Can I move to China and become Chinese in a few years? Hardly.

Pivoting from a discussion of nationality to one of ethnicity.

Nationality can have two meanings. Yes, he can belong to a nation but he will never be part of the historic ethnic group that are the Swedes.

Well, how about black Swedes, born and raised in Sweden and are Swedish citizens?

Sure, they are Swedish citizens but they'll never be Swedish. Like if I get Chinese citizenship, I'll never be Chinese. If I were born there I'd say I'm a European born in China. It's different than in America, Canada, Australia, New Zealand.

...the hell are you talking about? Nationality has a precise legal meaning and in this case, the protagonist of our thought experiment has been qualified for Swedish citizenship since he was fricking five years old. Anything else is an attempt to talk about something that the meme was not talking about.

I'm sure you're the expert on that.

:D

Why are you getting uptight? I agreed that he certainly has a right to citizenship. I was just making the distinction of nationality.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Nationality&hl=en&safe=off

The question of nationality is something Swedes can decide for themselves. They don't need your help.

I never said they did.

Now you're being just plain willy-nilly.

I didn't give an opinion.

Yup, definitely the expert.

He's obviously antithesis

Side note: "the historic ethnic group that are the Swedes" actually does not encompass a lot of Swedish people. You've got the Sami, Finns who never quite got encompassed within the Finnish border - it goes on, and most people have no idea how much ethnic Swede-ness they really get to claim. Mohammed has just as much a right to it as anyone else, otherwise you'd be disenfranchising a good chunk of the country.

No.

Well if thats the case we're all British.

You can be British without being English.

You can be English without being Anglo Saxon.

Or are they descended from the British Romans? Or the Celts? Or Norse raiders? Normans? Or, and here's a crazy idea, are the lines so blurry and so unimportant that it doesn't really mean anything? Are things like "English" and "Swede" and "American" more a collection of loose adaptable ideas than a concrete exclusionary definition? Aren't national identities really just tools of the powerful during times of struggle with other powerful people desperate to inspire a sense among the common worker that they, too, somehow, have skin in the game?

Could it be that all of this just a bunch of bullshit? Norwegians immigrate into Sweden all the time and never once experience a person saying "yeah, but you'll never be SWEDISH Swedish, you know?" And of all the comments on this page, not one is addressing the obvious: you don't actually give two shits about splitting hairs on ethnic lines - it's all about the color of his skin.

English*

Point still stands tho

What right? Those other groups are all Nordic, Mohammed will never be Nordic.

Maybe being born in China would make you slightly more Chinese. How do you think Chinese folks started to look the way they do?

From Chinese parents, duh.

Yeah, and how do you think THEIR ancestors became racially Chinese?

From Chinese parents, duh.

And how did those ancestors become racially Chinese? What about the time before humans settled in China?

2fofz1.gif (click to show) Chuck Norris upvote

Is it just me, or is the GIF stretched vertically?

But they have Finns!

Nice!

If Mohamed was born in Sweden by parents who are Swedish citizens he is - of course - also Swedish. Or he might have attained Swedish citizenship later in life, after living a minimum of five years in this country. Everything else is totally irrelevant in this case.

36pm45.gif (click to show) Mixing a drink and cheers

2nxfyp.gif (click to show) You are funny, nice rhyme.

Not mine, it's a copypasta, gotta be honest about it.

I really don't care, you posted it .... who cares if it came from some other place.

The American Dream? Hello?

They're talking about sweden and you bring up the american dream? You're not too bright, are you?

No. I thought one step ahead and thought to myself: If this guy thinks that people Shouldn't have Birth Right Citizenship, one of the hallmark characteristics of America, in Sweden, maybe he also thinks America shouldn't have Birth Right citizenship. Such a stance is simply put Unacceptable and Unamerican.

Personally I wouldn't defend that, but you do you.

"You're not too bright, are you?"

no need to insult anyone here now.

Thank you. Tis a most... venomous place.

In point of fact, many countries that had unrestricted jus soli have gotten rid of it, including all the countries in the oh so "progressive" EU (if they ever had it to begin with), which includes Sweden.

The only two "western" countries that still have it are the US and Canada, and even Canada still has one small restriction, that being that neither parent can be a diplomat.

"In point of fact, many countries that had unrestricted jus soli have gotten rid of it"

That is sad

"including all the countries in the oh so "progressive" EU"

Googled it. It appears that Germany, France and Ireland do have Jus Soli, even if a conditional one besides. That doesntreally matter in the context of this disscusion seeing as my point was that being against Birthright Citizenship is unamerican. Doesnt really matter what those twats in Europe are doing. Damn Sicialists the lot of them

"The only two "western" countries that still have [it]"

Yes and isnt that great that we and our Canadian cousins are one of the few countries in the world with unconditional Birthright Citizenship? Truly this is what mames America great. Land of the Free and the Equal. If your born here, your one of us. No questions asked.

"Canada still has one small restriction, that being that neither parent can be a diplomat"

Thats sad

"Googled it. It appears that Germany, France and Ireland do have Jus Soli, even if a conditional one besides."

Yes, that's /restricted/ jus soli, as opposed to the UN-restricted jus soli I was talking about. At least one of the parents must be a citizen, so it's technically not even jus soli, it's inherited citizenship, aka jus sanguinis.

"Truly this is what mames America great. Land of the Free and the Equal. If your born here, your one of us."

And it probably wouldn't be a problem /now/, if it hadn't been so heavily abused, particularly by families using their kids as anchor babies.

Not sure why the diplomat thing is sad, that's a /very/ minor number of people, barely a drop in the bucket, and is likely for the reason of political relations with other countries. Canada is (or was) more of a respected mediating country, we don't have the military might to back up taking strong political stances of our own over diplomatic incidences.

"Yes, that's /restricted/ jus soli, as opposed to the UN-restricted jus soli I was talking about. At least one of the parents must be a citizen, so it's technically not even jus soli, it's inherited citizenship, aka jus sanguinis"

The more you know

"And it probably wouldn't be a problem /now/, if it hadn't been so heavily abused, particularly by families using their kids as anchor babies."

True enough. America is great and we cant fault others for wanting to bathe in its greatness. Especially considering how tough our Immigration system is.

"Not sure why the diplomat thing is sad"

Idk. First thought that popped into my mind. On second thought it kinda makes sense so... eh?

So, if you get American citizenship, you're American.
But if you get Swedish citizenship, you're not Swedish by default. You need to prove yourself!

The posts by omnibus and jakks explain it well enough, read them.