Immigration.

I know that. I was just pointing out the disconnect between your name and what you are doing. Not trying to be a jerk about it.

I was in fact trolling you, thought that was obvious. I think what happened to the Native Americans was wrong, but to simply put it, this is our country now. We have no control over what our ancestors did.

Just pointing out that when say this is "OUR COUNTRY NOW" that "OUR" still includes Native Americans, the ones that didn't run or get forced out to Mexico or Canada. We are US Citizens. We do pay Taxes & Social Security. Equal Rights. Equal Opportunity. And Everything Else.

I'm referring to current illegal immigration from Mexico, Canada, etc.

though only like 40% ( i think that right) live there

Darwin's Theory of NATURAL.Selection /= the sort of "Social Darwinism" that WOLVES raise their packs to revere. Are you (WE) no better than that....

the universal one of not invading a land and killing the natives

Oh, mean like every other nation on this planet in the history of the planet? Yeah, because we white racist motherfookers hate everyone.

I'm unfamiliar with that one. Can you cite the code where the Native Americans wrote it down? My last recollection was that Native Americans were pretty much warring tribes that would enslave their enemies, kill and scalp their enemies and leave them to die of exposure, steal their resources, stampeded thousands of buffalo over cliffs (and were unable to consume all of them), and treated women as property.

You must be referring to FANTASY LAND where the Native Americans were nothing but peaceful hunter/gatherers who lived like they were 21st Century environmentalist liberals with a "live and let live" outlook.

Yoy clearly know nothing, I could tell you more about the different people and the wars in Europe than you can tell me of Native American culture. Some tribes were peaceful, some tribes were vicious andbecame more so when threatened. Some tribes were turncoats and spies. Every race has good and bad people, traitors, and greed. Of course you were taught that the native were all of those bad things and you arw eager to believe without acknowledging how the natives greeted the people, fed them, taught them of the land and what will grow. What would not. There were not wars, there was an invasion, many lies, many broken treaties, misunderstandings and eventually all out genocide.

Dude, you're so funny. I minored in American History. You're the idiot. The reason you could tell me about the history in Europe is because they had written language. The fact you forgot that tells me you probably still live in your mom's basement and are working as a burger flipper. LOL!

You're just a worthless Liberal trying to apply 21st Century thinking to the actions of 16th & 17th Century peoples.

First off I am not a dude. Second American history has been fraught with american propaganda in order to cast events that happened into a light of good americans bad indians. Yet there were many historical accounts that show intelligent leaders and welcoming peaceful tribes. Things got ugly and so history demonized Native Americans to justify the slaughter. Ive seen books that printed that we gave the Europeans diseases, we carried syphilis, and other ugly lies. I'm 44 years old, Ive studied every bit as much as you have and I'm also half white. I have two grown sons, one is a Sgt in the Army. I am not stupid just because you don't agree with me.

"There were not wars" WRONG http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/thanksgiving-guilt-trip-how-warlike-were-native-americans-before-europeans-showed-up/

There were no borders in the 1600's in North America. There was no "invasion." That's just a guilt trip bleeding hearts try to put on school children (and 44 year olds), most of whom swallow it hook, line, and sinker.

I'm so glad you've made it to 44 with your half-white guilt and misconceptions. Congratulations.

Do you even hear yourself? So it was only officially a war if it was decared to be so by the white men? Inhabitants have no rights to the land they thrived on for hundreds of years if they have no understanding of property laws, homesteading, and deeds? There were no borders even though your own anthropologists can pinpoint the territories that each tribe or shared language tribes were known for keeping to? My ancestors history has never been taught in school. I learned from my elders, college courses, research, trainings. I've seen the ongoing aftermath of what was done, how it still effects all of us today when men would rather continue to lie about what was done than just say yea, that was horrible, I hope to never see such atrocities ever again.

Yep. Eyes. Wide. Open. (my grandmother was full blooded Cherokee). I know all the lies, the truths, the stories, and the hilariously funny assertions made by the people who feel guilty that their great great great great great great great great grandparents had measles when they encountered a Native American tribe.

I'm familiar with the lie that it was an "invasion." And I understand the silly reasons people use that term (political mostly ... or just pure white guilt).

But history doesn't match with those assertions. Real history, that is. Not the recently made up stuff, Internet Top Ten lists, and people who haven't really studied.

Again, here you go. Twelve bucks gets you an acclaimed best seller on the history of Native American societies.
http://www.amazon.com/Guns-Germs-Steel-Fates-Societies/dp/0393317552/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1459947019&sr=8-1&keywords=Guns%2C+Germs%2C+and+Steel%3A+The+Fates+of+Human+Societies

And surprise, surprise, up to one third of Native American DNA has European roots.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/dna-analysis-shows-native-americans-had-european-roots-a-954675.html

Were there atrocities? Yes. But Native Americans were committing them against each other as well. Every nation (tribe?) has committed the same atrocities against their enemies since time immemorial. But the idea that there was some sort of European "invasion" has repeatedly been shown to be a laughable idea.

I will agree with you on these points. We all share a point of origination and spread out across the world, there is one race. Human.
There have always been horrible atrocities committed against our fellow men from time immemorial as there have always been conflicts, wars, greed, judgemental attitudes. piousness, and differing religious or spiritual beliefs. Native Americans were as corruptable and susceptible as any other man. I will not agree to deny that many men women and babies were slaughtered much more than those that died from disease. I won't justify the trail of tears or the boarding school assimilate or die nightmare. I refuse to let you piss on me and tell me it is rain. I know what my people went through and what they continue to struggle with to this day. I don't know why many are so desperate to cover up what was done, but case and point the statement that you made on how we slaughtered the Buffalo needlessly and wasted it. I know that you know thw US military was ordered to slaughter our food sources to weak the resolve of those holding out and refusing relocation. The Federal Government has acknowledged that so how is it beneficial to lie and flip responsibility? As far as I'm concerned I am an American too and I would not be comfortable living anywhere else. So as a fellow Citizen I wish you the best as I wish for us all and I'm done beating this dead horse.

You're not stupid, but your history is wrong in this case.

https://youtu.be/KuyHw8MLoEE
Look I am not advocating for open borders, I think that most Native people just think it is hypocritical to make such a huge fuss over people that may or may not have originally (Pre European Invasion) resided within what are now US borders, but even if they were from a tribe that was always in Mexico, they are still of the people that were here on this continent first. So what if we & you all originated in you say Asia/ most say Africa in Mesopotamia, if anything that just futher confirms that there are no races but the human race. Yet it was all fine and dandy land of opportunities and Statue of Liberty welcome to other immigrants traveling across oceans. I understand that you would like to carry pride in your ancestors can you do that without trying to belittle mine. Thank You

Study this:
http://www.amazon.com/Guns-Germs-Steel-Fates-Societies/dp/0393317552/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1459947019&sr=8-1&keywords=Guns%2C+Germs%2C+and+Steel%3A+The+Fates+of+Human+Societies

This is sincerely well stated. Colonists were just better at killing in a more organized way than they were.
It's Darwinism vs the social contract I guess.
Without social contract it's a free for all if everyone equally armed. Terrorists proving that now.

Ronburgandy, I believe might agree when I say " how the Indians acted is not justification for my actions"
In line with his "universal" law concept.

hello my ignorant friend read this http://www.toptenz.net/top-10-common-misconceptions-about-native-americans.php you ignorant fool

Oh, yeah, a "top ten" list on the Internet ... now THAT'S scientific research.
http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/thanksgiving-guilt-trip-how-warlike-were-native-americans-before-europeans-showed-up/

All of this I agree with other than Aboriginal Americans treating women as property. This varied between tribes and some were actually matriarchal societies. By the way, I have decided to call them "Aboriginal Americans" because it is more correct than the term "Native Americans." Technically, anyone born in America is a "native American." You might also call them "Indigenous Americans."

Actually they emigrated from Asia many thousands of years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Settlement_of_the_Americas

Bwahaha. What? Starting a colony on your front lawn and killing you isn't illegal? Where does it say that in the constitution? Oh my bad..

I'm intrigued, are you deliberately trying to be contentious in order to provoke a reaction?

Sorry, sarcasm squared. Forgot my audience. Was actually reacting to the defense that no Indian laws were violated in colonizing America. Which is technically true. "Universal" ethics as stated right above me were however trampled along with lives.

Point is I've never heard someone imply "Laws? What Indian laws were broken?" Like something a banker at Goldman Sachs would say.

It's the real challenge within this community, trying to convey an opinion/attitude with the written word but without intonation or gesture. I do admire your attack upon the "technicality" defence, you can almost hear "I vas only obeying orders" in the distance.

Tx. and agreed. In racism, only when the "other", the unknown threat is obliterated, then we back off.
The American i guan, basically wiped out was "the pagan heathen". Once under control.. "The charming savage"
Racism morphed from fear to condescension. The "other": Jews to nazis, native Americans to colonials, blacks to whites.. Etc. fear the unknown.

Interesting, I must admit that I have done no in-depth reading of sociology. But I will.

It's mostly my conjecture but well founded in psyche and sociology. Like Santa Claus is in part the remnants of infant pagan sacrifice guilt.. In South America there is a "black peter" still.. Who handles the naughty list by taking the bad kids away..
The point that was asserted to me that sticks is that racism is the scar of slavery or how we collectively process the trauma of mans inhumanity to man.

David Mamet, strangely enough, the screenplay writer wrote a short book on it from point of Judaism.

Indian.. Not I guan. Lol

"pgmjr.jpg (click to show)"

Exactly. Our unconscious guilt won't help solve this issue. Well said

course

I acknowledged it, but decided against correction because of the multiple meaning application. It's a coarse subject.

Unlike many other people, I agree with you. People (including the natives) hate others invading their land- that's just the fact. Not sure why there are so many haters out there today...