Tl;Dr, Science_whiz_nat has a long and obvious history of being immature and childish, has an overwhelming superiority complex, and has exposing evidence against her implying that she has faked traumatic irl experiences for attention.
In my short time on the ms_memer_group, there is no user who I have debated with more than Science_whiz_nat. I'm pretty confident that you all know at least a little bit about what Natalie has done, but some context for why I'm actually writing this can be found in the images posted to MSMG on the night of 7/28/24. The situation tonight started with a post by Egotistical_Zan, which is the current user name for the user Spire.
As you can see in the image, it shows in Spire's bio that they are taken by four different people, therefore implying that they are polyamorous which I do believe is something that they have been very open about. However, Nat decided to make the unnecessary comment that "Polygamy is illegal." Spire would then have a debate with Nat and would post a screenshot of said conversation, so I will show the screenshot.
As you can see, Nat said that polygamy is technically a crime, which like I said, was irrelevant to the post. Spire correctly said that they were not married and corrected Nat by saying they were polyamorous and not polygamous, and that polygamy disgusts them. Nat then says that polyamory is polygamy, which I don't even need to explain why that's stupid because Spire explained for me. In case you don't want to read Spire's explanation, I know that this post is long enough, basically polyamory is just dating multiple people at once while polygamy is restricted to marriage. Polyamory is specifically entirely consensual from every party and is just loving multiple people. Any person with a functional brain can see that it is just as valid as any other romantic or sexual orientation or preference. And even stupider is the fact that Nat decides to say that it's the same thing as polygamy. I understand somewhat if you don't know the definition of polyamorous, I myself didn't even know the term for a long time despite the fact that I've always been in love with multiple people at one time. However, the fact that she didn't understand the definition of polygamy tips me off. That's a term that most people learn in the sixth grade.
However, this isn't exactly super relevant. If this had been where the story ended, I wouldn't be putting on my best impression of Penguinz0 right now. Despite the fact that she was obviously and clearly proven wrong, Nat decides to continue the conversation by saying that they are the same thing and that the difference is a little bit of wording. Spire then makes an excellent rebuttal which I'll just let you read for yourself.
Nat's response here is to the previous screenshot where Spire takes Nat over their knee and spanks her bare bottom, and I just want to point out the use of what I can only assume is a Nat original drawing of one of her nonsensical OC's here. If you're using an image to tell someone to shut up, it just shows that you're either not taking the debate seriously or you're just immature, and we know she is taking this all very seriously. Nat literally see's Spire's whole paragraph about the difference between polygamy and polyamory and says "nuh uh, they're still the same," and then has the balls to use all caps, something that Spire keeps their cool enough to never do in this debate I'm pretty sure, at least not on this particular post. Keep in mind, everything so far is just the one post. So Spire makes their frankly great response, like that is a legitimately good response that you would see on some professional debate competition, serious props to Spire for being actually intelligent. But anyways, after that Nat makes another response which I will show again
And again she uses a random image for no good reason. This isn't helping her case, it's just making her look like a buffoon. But anyways, Nat makes the bold claim that both polygamy and polyamory are unethical and that Spire is a hedonist, which for those who don't know, a hedonist is someone who values physical and often sexual pleasure above most or all other things. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to decipher that Nat believes that dating multiple people is something you do strictly for pleasure. Spire once again makes a wonderful and mature response by stating that polyamory is completely ethical, which it is. Everything that Spire is saying is objectively true. And in the spirit of being completely unbiased as I myself am polyamorous like Spire, I reached out to a couple users who, for their privacy I will keep anonymous, who are not polyamorous and they agree with me, that polyamory is completely ethical.
This is wear things just become comical and Nat just looks more and more like a clown.
As you can see here, Nat's next response is just "not reading allat" as if that was really very much to read. Spire is right here, if this is her best counterargument, then that's a shit counterargument. Then, Nat just reiterates her previously proven incorrect statement that BOTH polygamy and polyamory are unethical. I also included in the screenshot a response made to Spire's original response to Nat's comment that started all of this, that response being someone saying that they believe that dating more than one person feels like cheating. I included this because it shows that Spire, unlike Nat, is completely mature here. They respect this third person's opinion. The only reason that this hasn't devolved into an argument when Nat's conversation has is because Nat refuses to admit when she's wrong and that other people can have different opinions and life styles.
The rest of the argument is just Nat saying the same thing over and over again, that she believes that polyamory is unethical. Spire keeps on responding by saying that they are a) just defending their beliefs and b) that Nat is acting immature and childish. Which she is, she literally uses a random pizza tower image for no reason. It doesn't help her argument, it's not funny, it's not even some image that she made or that insults the other person.
(here's the OG post if you want to read the whole conversation: imgflip.com/i/8ylish)
This should be where the story ends but because we are dealing with a borderline Neanderthal here, you know it's not where it ends. Spire posted about the debate after Nat's original comment, and Nat commented on that post saying that they are, in fact, the same thing. Even after Spire had already proven otherwise. I don't want to go over every detail of the responses on this image because they are far more infuriating. Each one of Nat's responses here are just her either being a stone headed nitwit who's incapable of processing basic information, or her just insulting Spire unprompted. To Nat's credit, Spire did call her stupid before Nat insulted them, but not only was Spire's response much more warranted, it was also much funnier as well as much less offensive. Nat's response is literally calling Spire a wh*re, which is a serious allegation, where as Spire's response is nothing more than a fancily worded playground taunt.
Nat then says that both polyamory and polygamy should be illegal as if there is any way to possibly illegalize the act of calling multiple people your romantic partner. It shouldn't be that hard to wrap your head around the idea that if everybody consents than no harm is done to everybody, but by golly Nat sure is having a hard time with that. It's like she's forgotten that things like threesomes and open relationships exist, which is just a couple steps down from polyamory. Spire than makes a point that sexual harassment is technically not illegal, and shows a google search proving their point. This is where we get our second look at when Nat doesn't understand the difference between terms. Sexual harassment violates civil law but is not considered a criminal act. This basically just says that a cop can't arrest you and say you were arrested for "Sexual harassment." You need to have committed a different crime in the process to be properly arrested. Luckily, 99.9% of the time, you do commit another crime in the act of sexual harassment, usually being r*pe or attempted r*pe, both serious crimes that you can get arrested for. Back to Nat, she refuses to understand these concepts and Spire does not explain them. They make the correct decision and back off, understanding that Nat is a brick wall that arguing with is fruitless.
(Link: imgflip.com/i/8ylky0)
Once again, our story does not end here. While this is where Spire no longer has relevance, a new anti-hero joins the fray, and it's yours truly. I had been watching the Nat drama but not commenting on it basically since the first post about it, but where I drew the line and intervened was when Nat posted publicly about it. It was just a screenshot that I already shared and saying in the title that it was hedony. Now, if you're not an English major like I am, you might not have recognized that hedony is not a word. I of course commented about the situation, calling her out for not knowing the definition of the words she was saying and pointing out that "hedony" is not a real word and that the word she was looking for was hedonism, which I already explained the definition of.
After she gives a sort of right but not actually correct definition of hedonism, I pull out the Merriam-Webster definition and slap her across the face with it, as well as a whole mini essay just further proving that her beliefs are just objectively wrong.
Now before I go forward I do want to mention that it is complexly okay to have an opinion and believe that polyamory is unnatural and unethical. However, Nat's ignorance to the difference between polyamory and polygamy as well as her refusal to accept polyamory and leave people alone about it is where the issue stems from. She made an incorrect assumption and was corrected about it and has refused to leave the conversation since.
Now, even after all of this, Nat decides to have the balls to post this.
She seems to believe that she somehow one the argument that never really was an argument, it really was just her being ignorant and Spire defending their belief. I, as well as the users sure_why_not and angelicallylaleconparticuliere, called her out on this, saying that she really didn't win anything. And her responses to this were just "womp womp, yes i did win because nuh uh." She provided no proof of her winning anything and acted like a child throughout all of it. Nobody is supporting her, she just has this overwhelming superiority complex that has caused her to believe that she's just better than everyone else.
She would say later that she, and I directly quote from the title of a later post, "won because [she] was trying to piss y'all off." Not only did she give no indication that this was just meant to make people mad, but this just makes her seem more and more like an immature asshole. In the grand scheme of things, she may have won this battle just because it gave her her 30 minutes of spotlight that she so desperately craves from a meme website, but it doesn't change the fact that her behavior is a load of dirty barnacles. It's simply childish and selfish of her. She has the balls to talk about ethics and ethical behavior when she can't even withhold proper manors.
Now, going forward is when my story will become a little less credible as I did not see nor screenshot any of what I'm about to discuss, however after her post about "winning the argument," her next post was about her asking to be unbanned. After a brief interview with angelically, the mod responsible for the ban, I learned that in about a two minute time frame, Nat made literal death threats to Spire in now deleted comments. This, in addition to some alleged SH and suicide baits, breaks the TOS and was grounds for from what I can tell a week long comment ban.
Nat's next few posts are just her whining about being banned as if she didn't literally break the rules and begging angelically to unban her. She pulls the "I'm going to tell" card and threatens "notifying darthswede" which as far as I can tell didn't work. She makes two posts in no-filter where she says she's going to hang out there for a while, with one of the posts saying that she'll "try to avoid drama so much" if we give her a second chance as if this is her first offense. I have been a member of msmg for a month and I have already witnessed what the girl gets into. This is not the first time she has broken a rule. She has told people some variant of "kys" hundreds of times. This just happens to be a rare time when she gets severe punishment because she tempted god a little too much. In the title of that same post, she tries to play victim and say that she just wants to see her friends again and that msmg needs to treat her with respect to, as if this entire drama wasn't started by her. The other post made in no-filter is now deleted, with the only piece of evidence that it ever existed being a comment that was posted by sure_why_not.
She was really trying to pull the "I'm sorry" excuse as if she wasn't just bragging about winning the debate that started all of this. If you're going to be an asshole, at least carry through with it and don't be a pissbaby when you get in trouble for it. If anything, I hope this experience will teach Nat a lesson.
The final post made by Nat was posted to memes_overload, saying that she is taking a week long break from imgflip. Now, I don't deny that she will take this break. She very much needs it. This person is chronically online this meme website and spends most her time here just posting random stuff like whatever song she's listening to at the time. She has spent entire real life events while also on imgflip and detailing every little thing to people who couldn't give less of a shit. The only reason she does this sort of stuff is because we let her. And the fact is is that it's all for attention. While gathering information for this, I had a lengthy conversation with sure_why_not, also known as T, someone who has had a long history with Nat, and she shared her personal distaste for her.
Allegedly, not too long ago, Nat made a series of controversial posts about how she was being abused by her stepfather and neglected by her mother. T, who had her own experience with abuse, advised Nat to call the police. Nat was stubborn, refusing to call the police because "it wouldn't do anything." This is the final example I will give of Nat refusing to admit when she's wrong. It takes just a little bit of googling to confirm that when police are told that there is a home where a child(ren) are in danger, they are required to break down the door without a warrant and arrest any adults who may be endangering the children. This led T to assume that Nat's abuse story is faked for attention, something that I must agree with. Not only does her story not make sense, but it doesn't make sense as to why she would post about it on a meme website where nobody cares about her feelings for any reason other than attention.
The reason this all is relevant is because it simply proves that Nat is an attention wh*re. Because she can't obtain it irl, she searches for attention online and does anything for it while also doing the minimum amount of work required to get said attention. Nothing Nat does is worth the time of day, but everyone talks about her because she only ever pisses people off. Her belief that she is so much better than everyone is so flawed in so many ways that it just makes me sick.
I'm mostly posting about all this to inform the people about Nat and what she's done, not to slander her in any way. I'm also doing this because there is a modicum of hope that either she sees this and grows from this experience or other people use this to not repeat her mistakes. Thank you for reading,
-nameless
I completely agree with what you’ve said except in regarding the abuse claims.
If the abuse was true (which, by the way, I absolutely do not think it is), Nat was indeed justified in reporting abuse here — while this may have originated as a meme website, and is still treated as such in many circumstances, many users in multiple streams — especially MSMG and LGBTQ — now use it as a serious platform for communicating with people. Four years ago announcement templates didn’t even exist, but MSMG changed that. It’s the reason Imgflip is now utilized by individuals in a social aspect. People have talked about personal things in their life here before, like road trips, for example. I’ve had lengthy conversations with people here which have nothing to do with the site itself. I’ve seen posts mention the deaths of friends or family. In the 12 years since Imgflip first became public, the site has grown past meme-making and now appears as social media in many aspects.
So reporting abuse here is extremely justified, as people here would actually care about it. We’re not sociopaths.
I understand your arguments a lot, it makes me actually realize how much of an asshole Nat is. Before this post, the only problem I had with Nat was that she compared a literal joke that doesn't kill anybody to 9/11. Although I didn't see this as a problem that would flip my opinion, I see the problems you named as such. However, there is one flaw in your argumentation, and it's about the abuse situation.
First off, I want to agree with a reply Prometheus aka Silver made. This site, especially MSMG, has evolved to a digital place that isn't only for memes but also for personal stuff, and Nat uses it as such. My main flaw in your argumentation however are your arguments on why the story with the abuse is fake. You say that she refused to call the police and used sources from the internet on why to call the police. What you didn't mention/recognize are psychological aspects: The parents, and even if they are only step parents, are the #1 family figures for a child, and calling the cops on so close family members isn't easy. Nat had this going on in her mind, which led to other thoughts on why not to call the cops, such as that it wouldn't work.
Although there may be arguments against my argumentation and the evidence against Nat is stronger than the one for her, I believe that my argumentation is at least enough to make Nat innocent until proven guilty in this allegation and guilty with proof in all the other allegations. Or in other words: To bring me fully on your side, I need more evidence on why Nat faked the abuse.
Caption this Meme