Yay or nay, and why?

on a serious note tho, no. god is not real

"I spawned on a mountain, then was flown to my parents doorstep in a little basket like you see in the Grinch" oh wow, and I always thought it was a stork who dropped babies off on front porches, how ignorant of me!

This is a new revelation to me. I guess my husband and I got it all wrong. I'll have to break it to him and wait for the bird next time.

hehe
i wanna say something but i wont

Oh I know you do, but this is a discussion about the existence of God. Let's keep it PG rated at the very least. ;)

“at the very least’ so does that mean i can do PG-13? Rated R? Not rated X ofc, but ye

Fair enough, can you provide proof that God is not real?

well, what would be more logical is to ask you for evidence that he DOES exist.

You first my friend:) and why would that be more logical?

because you can’t really provide t somethingDOESNT exist lmfao
it DOESNT exist. you literally can’t find proof

Atheist argue all the time that God doesn't exist, yet they have no proof. Because you're correct it's easier to prove God exist than He doesn't.

The universe exists is the proof.

S C I E N C E

Yes science is proof that God exists

Uhm you gotta explain that

You exist, did you appear out of thin air? (Note I'm asking dumb questions not because I'm dumb, there's a point to this, lol)

Yes i did! I spawned on a mountain, then was flown to my parents doorstep in a little basket like you see in the Grinch

Certitude is incompatible with faith. You can be certain that you truly believe something, but not that the belief is factually true.

If you knew the substance of your faith was FACT, it would not be FAITH. Because words.

Therefore, any statement to the effect that "god is real" can be reconciled with the preface "I believe that". It's already implied, but spelling it out explicitly helps shine a light on the inherent contradiction of "I believe X...X is a fact".

Science is a belief system of sorts, insofar as bits keep getting refined as new evidence comes to light. The specifics are subject to revision. The system itself--scientific method, mathematics, etc. are immutable. They existed before we discovered them and will continue to exist independently of us.

Personally not sure how accurate the first law of thermodynamics is, but I believe it represents a fundamental truth. A truth which precludes the possibility of the big bang--or anything--appearing out of nothing. Was it a singularity containing all the entropy that birthed the current universe? Was it a perforation into another universe or dimension? Where do souls come from and what are they made of? If they're eternal, how long before all available entropy in the universe is converted into souls?

The frontier of science shares with religion a dependence on faith. Neither can disprove the other, nor can god be "proved" because, again, "faith". Parts of science can be proved, which is the most I'm comfortable stating with certainty. The rest I'm content to leave to people with way more intelligence and way more education than myself.

Thor

Which God? Ukko? Perhaps, but do you consider him the same as Thor?

Any God, is there a singular all powerful being orchestrating the universe or are we humans that just appeared out of nowhere and headed no where?

"is there a singular all powerful being orchestrating the universe or are we humans that just appeared out of nowhere and headed no where?"

That's a false dichotomy fallacy, strawman fallacy, and appeal to consequences fallacy

Yikes, how could I be so fallacious in one sentence?! Lol. So what 2 alternatives are there?

"what 2 alternatives are there?"

What do you mean

"is there a singular all powerful being orchestrating the universe or are we humans that just appeared out of nowhere and headed no where?"

That's a false dichotomy fallacy, strawman fallacy, and appeal to consequences fallacy

You just accused me of having all these falicies so restate what I said without all the errors. Either God exists or God doesn't right? How is that a fallacy?

"Either God exists or God does not exist" is a true dichotomy. It is a false dichotomy to say that either God exists or humans appeared out of nowhere and are headed nowhere. I don't know anyone who doesn't believe in God but believes humans came from nowhere.

I and many other atheists believe that humans are the result of natural processes going back many millions of years.

God created the universe and the conditions that allow life to exist on this planet. The exact form of God is difficult for me to say. Perhaps I will find out if my spirit is allowed to leave this place. What form do you think God is? In Genesis it says man was created in God’s image, does that mean God is humanoid in shape? I believe that passage means man’s soul was created in the image of God’s spirit and God doesn’t have a physical form.

I agree with you. I think the Genesis passage refers to the human soul being in the likeness of God's spirit because like you said, God does not have a physical form like us. So looks like we're on the same page here.

😄 Sorry it wasn’t a better debate. I’m trying to be honest about my feelings instead of playing devil’s advocate all the time.

I was about to reply with a rebuttal but reread your comment and realized I actually agree totally. If only all debates were this easy 😂

uhm should i be concerned? you’re a mfing teacher, and you don’t even acknowledge all the scientific evidence over hundreds of years pointing to a phenomenon like the big bang?

Fun fact, A Catholic Priest actually formulated the Big bang theory. Do you think he was an athiest?

No. But you don’t have to be an atheist to believe in the big bang smh

"It’s because spirituality is something humans need to fill in blank space"

Bingo, humans will never find true fulfillment in only the physical becuase we are also spiritual beings having a soul destined to be with God in heaven forever. Spirituality is part of our being and yes it does fill a void.

"we are also spiritual beings having a soul destined to be with God in heaven forever"

How do you know?

"Spirituality is part of our being and yes it does fill a void"

The word spirituality is very vague, and means many different things to many different people.

That would take more than a comment on a meme site to answer. I'm on my way to church now to worship an imaginary being for no good reason because I'm just a speck on a big spinning rock headed no where with no purpose ;)

You're right it is a very obscure word but basically there's two worlds the physical which is tangible and the spiritual which is not.

"I'm on my way to church now to worship an imaginary being for no good reason because I'm just a speck on a big spinning rock headed no where with no purpose ;)"

You're headed to church to worship a being you believe exists. The reason why you believe that being exists, I can't say, since it's different for different people.

"You're right it is a very obscure word but basically there's two worlds the physical which is tangible and the spiritual which is not"

Lots of things exist which aren't tangible, like emotions and thoughts and ideas.

" Atheists (the ones I know, at least) don't say that something doesn't exist unless it's physical and tangible." Like God?

Correct

"Lots of things exist which aren't tangible, like emotions and thoughts and ideas."

Yes, yet I don't see atheists arguing that emotions, thoughts and ideas don't exist even though they can't be quantitatively measured and proven.

"yet I don't see atheists arguing that emotions, thoughts and ideas don't exist even though they can't be quantitatively measured and proven"

Correct. Atheists (the ones I know, at least) don't say that something doesn't exist unless it's physical and tangible.

Meanwhile while I'm working on my response to an age old question that pretty much all of humanity ponders and thousands of books have been written about here's a question for you:

Do love and hate exist and how do you know?

"Do love and hate exist and how do you know?"

They exist as concepts in the mind. Do they exist external to the mind? I don't believe so. If every single human suddenly vanished, I don't think love and hate as we understand them would still exist.

Other animals have feelings which we could call love, which makes it more complicated.

I'm guessing you probably don't have a future in romantic novel writing 😉

An abstract concept and a figment of the imagination are different things

"I'm guessing you probably don't have a future in romantic novel writing"

Probably not 😔

Uhm sorry for this but can I ask you a question?

Can this energy have a name, like God?

The god of the Bible and energy aren't the same thing, so it wouldn't make sense to call energy God

What if I don't worship the God of the Bible? could God be a form of energy?

When most people use the word "God", they are referring to a being with specific qualities and characteristics. They aren't usually using it as a synonym for energy.

Some people do use the word god as a synonym for energy, but since we already have the word energy, calling the same thing god is confusing and pointless.

Yup
But it is still not real
And we know that

And we know that.... how?

I believe God exists by logic, how does the universe come from nothing unless there was something that started it all. Big bang if that happened was initiated by another force, I call that force God. What do you call it?

Chemicals

Chemicals are combination of various elements. Where did these elements come from in nature?

Energy, which has always existed

which came from?

They’re natural

While I don't think the Big Bang really could've happened, the only way it possibly could've happened is if a God caused it. It's a scientific law that creation creates and accidents destroy. It's a scientific law that life begets life and spontaneous generation has been disproven so many times and the scientific community has pushed it into unverifiable fields so many times it's frickin laughable now. The big bang breaks so many natural laws so the only way it could've happened is if a supernatural being caused it. Unless you want to suggest that a world where the supernatural doesn't exist (at least that's what atheist scientists argue) was created by a supernatural event, which makes no sense.
The reasons I don't think the Big bang is possible are that there's so many problems with the old earth theory, including 1) oceans would be much saltier from volcanoes dumping salt in the oceans if it were that old, 2), animals that were thought to have been extinct for 65 million years have been found and discovered to be common in certain areas, meaning they've either avoided fossilization for 65 million years or something is wrong with the dating systems, 3) radio metric dating is not very reliable, as evidenced by mt St Helens, where rock was dated to be over 300K years old despite it being less than 10 years old, and 4) why does Venus rotate in the other direction if an explosion created the solar system, this breaks the conversion of angular momentum law (I may have a word wrong in that) that when force pushes forcefully, everything will be forced in that direction, nothing would defy it, especially not something created by it.

"the only way it possibly could've happened is if a God caused it"

How you did rule out every single other possibility? And can you show me how you know a god is even a candidate explanation? You use "god" as a convenient catch-all for anything you can't explain, without even showing that a god exists.

"It's a scientific law that creation creates and accidents destroy"

No it's not. And saying that "creation creates" doesn't make sense. "Creation" is an effect, not a cause.

"It's a scientific law that life begets life"

No it's not. It's what we typically observe, but saying that non-living matter can't become living matter hasn't been proven.

"The big bang breaks so many natural laws"

Which ones? And how?

"the only way it could've happened is if a supernatural being caused it"

No one has demonstrated that anything "supernatural" exists. No one has demonstrated that a supernatural being exists. Your inability to understand how it could've happened naturally doesn't mean it didn't

"Unless you want to suggest that a world where the supernatural doesn't exist (at least that's what atheist scientists argue)"

Scientists don't argue that. They just say that if anything supernatural does exist, we can't observe or test it.

"The reasons I don't think the Big bang is possible are that there's so many problems with the old earth theory"

The Big Bang theory isn't about how the Earth formed

"1) oceans would be much saltier from volcanoes dumping salt in the oceans if it were that old"

Where'd you read that?

"2), animals that were thought to have been extinct for 65 million years have been found and discovered to be common in certain areas, meaning they've either avoided fossilization for 65 million years or something is wrong with the dating systems"

You're confusing fossilization with extinction.
That's not a problem with the dating methods, either. And that doesn't disprove an old Earth anyway.

"3) radio metric dating is not very reliable"

It's very reliable. We know the decay rates for numerous isotopes, and they've never been observed to change.

"as evidenced by mt St Helens, where rock was dated to be over 300K years old despite it being less than 10 years old"

Source? And anomalies like that are well understood by geologists.

"4) why does Venus rotate in the other direction"

That has literally nothing to do with the age of the universe or the Earth

"if an explosion created the solar system"

Astronomers don't say that an explosion created the solar system

"this breaks the conversion of angular momentum law"

How, exactly?

BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHA

That better be /j

you didn't read much of that did you...

bruh
you literally contradict yourself 892739587 times in there lfmao

how-
also according to my calculations there aren't even 892739587 words in that passage

I literally asked how I contradicted myself, the last part was me being sarcastic-

You were saying it was impossible because it went against scientific laws, then you suggested god did it.

but I explained that. First off, I said I don't believe God did it. Then I said that only God COULD do it because it breaks science. Science is the study of the natural laws of nature. If God exists, He created scientific laws and can easily break them. Thus God is not subjected to science, it's subjected to Him. So He could easily cause a big bang no matter how unscientific it is. now I don't think that's what happened, but that's the best case for the big bang having happened. What can't be possible is the supernatural happening without cause, which is what an atheistic belief of the big bang suggests.

There is no proof that god exists. There is proof of the big bang

well what proof do you have to defend that statement? I presented an argument for mine. And "the scientific community says so" isn't a valid answer. A few hundred years ago, the scientific community still believed in spontaneous generation (and tbh anyone who believes in abiogenesis, which is basically the big bang without God, technically still does). Plus the scientific community has a lot of modern age bias too

"And "the scientific community says so" isn't a valid answer"

But you think "the Bible says so" is?

"anyone who believes in abiogenesis, which is basically the big bang without God, technically still does"

Abiogenesis isn't "the Big Bang without God", and it's not spontaneous generation either.

So essentially, you’re being a science-denier? Because at our current stage of development, the best answer we’ve proven and come up with is a phenomenon like the big bang

and yet you haven't presented any reasonable argument for why that's the case. (Actually you haven't presented an argument at all). You just said I'm denying science even though I used science to defend my beliefs, just because it doesn't match the common beliefs of today. Well, Vesalius didn't match the beliefs of his day, and we know his name more than any of the scientists who thought he was an idiot. Numbers don't make right. And I'm not the only one with these beliefs btw
Also, you can never "prove" the big bang. It supposedly happened millions of years ago and we can't see the past. The big bang is just as unprovable as a God would be, but even more so because a God can at least reveal himself to people through events, whereas a big bang can never do that.
What the big bang really is is the scientific community throwing spontaneous generation into a field they can't verify for the zillionth time after it's been disproven. First it was microorganisms, but eventually we got to understand those and pasteur disproved even that in 1859 (guess what else was published that very year?), now it's the past, which we can never verify.

I gtg to bed now tho

I mean science changes right? Back before microscopes we didn't even know the cell existed. But the spiritual realm doesn't really change.

Because we make it up

Interesting that these "made up" ideas have been pretty consistent for a millennia, the idea of God, angels, devils, heaven and hell aren't novel in the 21st century. Sure you have different religions some monotheistic others polytheistic but the idea of good and evil and powers beyond us has always been around.

It’s because spirituality is something humans need to fill in blank space

You're right, I actually don't rule out the Big bang. I do believe however that God was still behind the big bang happening in the first place.

BAHAHAHHAH dude, im actually gonna follow u now. You keep saying the best things. Watch this youtube link, you wont regret it. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=t_ad-rfvtIA

Thanks for misgendering me and for the link

I wasnt following you, because you said you followed me for no reason and that you follow everyone. I dont do that. Also, how/when did i misgender you?

How are you chatting with me if you don't follow me. You called me dude, dude.

BRUH MOMENT
you’re a site mod. you should know
you can memechat with anyone as long as they’re following u
also, I use dude for both genders

I'm gonna bank on the fact it is nearly 3 in the morning and I'm sleep deprived, not that I really just said something that dumb.

" you can memechat with anyone as long as they’re following u"

So you follow me or not because we do memechat

YOU follow me. I memechatted to you first, and u responded.

And that was hilarious. I'm putting my money on I Dream of Genie actually created everything

Yes. That’s how it really went.

What brought about the big bang?

Yes I'm a teacher I try to teach students how to engage in CIVIL dialogue on opposing views. Emphasis on civil. *cough*

Seems like you do too, I heard you cough in my other meme

I coughed once. You coughed like 123 times. Also, pls check ur memechat occasionally

I'm trying to keep up with the 123 notifications you sent me

hm

BWAHAHAHAHA, I had to block that one a few times for that reason,,,

Thing is, your sole counter 'argument' throughout this meme is "but science."
You've not offered any proof otherwise, not that you or anyone else can.

If you think about it, how is it even possible for a spiritual being like God to communicate with a physical being like ourselves. It's like saying I can't see air therefore it doesn't exist. Well before the instruments we have now you could only see the effects of air like through wind or breath. I think that's how God makes himself known, through His creation. How do we know emotions like love and anger exist except through their effects?

Not sure you want me to go there.

God, presuming you mean Yahweh, is not a spiritual being in the OT because the Hebrews didn't believe in that concept. They believed in the physical. Which, of course, is more realistic. If things veer off into another realm which is basically intangible, that makes it that much more distant from reality, and thus less perceivable.