Decriminalization Enables Substance Abuse

They already decriminalized rioting.

This is legislating based on what is best for the law violator, not what is in the best interest of public safety.

It wasn't by legislation, it was by not enforcing the law. Trump got around that somewhat by deputizing state police so rioters could be federally charged.

Oh -- I think we're criss-crossed. I was talking about the drug decriminalization.

I'm talking about rioting, but non-enforcement of drug laws happen as well.

Pander to crazy, get crazy back

Their brains Are Gone

Only the war on marijuana was dumb. Heroin and meth are serious addiction

You can't force an addict to quit. Substance abuse is a disease that attacks the will, among other things. "Intervention" only works with the willing. And you continue to see the problem only from the user's perspective. Substance abuse is not a victimless crime. There are public safety concerns, not to mention that it is substance abuse itself that breaks apart families and destroys future employment.

Those are some big 'ifs,' but I do agree with you. I do not think that decriminalization a step in this direction though.

You can't force a murderer to quit. Gun use is a disease that attacks the will, among other things. "Intervention" only works with the willing. And you continue to see the problem only from the user's perspective. Gun use is not a victimless crime. There are public safety concerns, not to mention that it is gun use itself that breaks apart families and destroys future employment.

So your argument is that you can substitute any issue in place of drugs? Nice try, but the argument is not as generic as you suggest.

You can put a murderer in prison and deny him his next victim. There is no evidence that gun use is the result of chemical dependence, but volumes of data exist that support genetic predisposition to chemical dependency. There are legitimate uses for guns, while there are none for heroin and cocaine. Gun use directed at humans is a crime, and no one, not even gun owners, has suggested decriminalizing murder.

Murderers kill people in prison...

Opiods and stimulants have many legitamate medical uses

Guns are passed through families like genetics, sometimes father to son, sometimes mother to daughter, guns are inherited.

Drugs used on people without consent is a crime, and not even doctors suggest decriminalization of nonconsenual drugging.

Your attempts to equate these arguments fall flat.

Yes, murderers can kill in prison. So then we just let them roam free? I know, let's provide them with clean bullets so their victims won't die of something other than the bullet itself.

Sure opioids and stimulants do have legitimate uses, but heroine and cocaine are not among those that do. And when such are used under the supervision of a doctor they are referred to as medication rather than drugs of abuse. The difference is that drugs of abuse are used for "recreation" rather than treatment of a medical condition.

Gun owners are not chemically dependent on gun use.

Nonconsensual drug use? Now you're really reaching...

They will get what they deserve.

The thing that makes me angry about this is that I know that this doesn't work. I'm not a CSAC, but I can tell that failing to hold substance abusers accountable will never result in them having an 'Ah ha!' moment.

You're an extremist.

People need help and you want to punish them for suffering, seems inhumane, kinda gross.

You need an "ah ha!" moment to learn compassion

And you need experience. Enabling is not compassion. Accountability is not apathy. The people who need help aren't seeking it. But by all means let's weaken the law and allow them to continue to destroy themselves and their communities.

Yeah, I see what you mean about enabling. Smoking anything is bad for you. Criticzing tobacco smokers while opening mj dispensaries is the hypocrisy poster child.

Are you implying that the prison system is better suited for compassion and treatment of drug addicts?

Because that is how this reads.

Should drug addicts be in the prison system, or the Healthcare system? Easy question.

If I had a magic wand, I would make substance abuse treatment free and the personal cost of continuing to use massive. The War on Drugs focused too much on the supply side without really addressing the demand. The fact that this did not work does not mean that we should declare "Ally, ally outs in free" and allow drug use without consequence. Substance abuse is not a pure healthcare issue, because there is a volitional component.

Once again, though, I point out that you are considering addiction as an issue that only affects addicts. There are public safety concerns.

If you had a magic wand, why wouldn't you just remove the cause of substance abuse?

Lack of imagination?

Drug use should be consequence free

Drug addiction should allow treatment for free

Violence should be treated as a criminal matter, as it always has been

You don't have to combine the drugs and violence together, we could address problems with the best tools.

Organized crime, you know the thing that happens during prohibition, is the biggest problem with the current system. Legalize, and the black market that funds organized crime disappears.

2+2=4

Touche! That would be a far better use of a magic wand! I suggested a magic wand because I doubt that I could get the necessary support for free treatment and massove consequences for continued use.

Without consequences, drug use will continue. The biggest problem is not organized crime (though that certainly is one - surprising; I wouldn't have thought that the pharmaceutical companies would tolerate the competition) but the decay it causes to families, communities and our society as a whole.

Human behavior operates at a level beyond simple arithmetic.

"Consequences" always happen

I think the word you were looking for is "punishment"

People can't be punished into healing

People can only be treated, by healthcare professionals, in order to heal

No amount of torture will cure cancer

No, I meant "consequences." As in, the result of one's actions. You are correct that people cannot be punished into healing. At the same time, refusing to be treated and continuing to use elevates the behavior to the level of violating the law and becoming a risk to public safety.

My solution would be 100% taxes on drugs and make them completely legal, then use the tax money to fund free medical treatment.