If Turning Point USA were honest

If you really understood what capitalism it then you would know that you are 100% wrong. Marx was an idiot. Look at every Communist, Socialist or Fascist country. None of them ever gave anyone but poverty, misery and death.

You cannot find one single Socialist country where any citizen has prospered except for the ruling elites.

Capitalism has lifted more people out of poverty than any other economic philosophy known to man. Every single time it is tried.

All it takes is just a little bit of looking around at the world. It is so very clear that Venezuela, North Korea and China have the worst poverty and worst human rights problems in the world. They are not Capitalist nations, they are Socialist. You may call them Communist but all Socialist regimes eventually become Communist. That is just how it has always happened. Socialist rulers just cannot control themselves.

Some even start off that way. Vladimir Lenin called himself a "Democratic Socialist" during the Bolshevik revolution. When he died and Joseph Stalin took over, Stalin called himself an "International Socialist". Hitler called himself a "National Socialist". Mussolini was the father of Fascism but Fascism was just his version of Socialism. He was a Socialist long before he saw some of the it's flaws and tried to fix them. He called his fixes, "Fascism".

Look it up and you will know that I am correct.

When you enjoy freeloading so much you make an economic theory for it.

That is what sold Bernie Sanders on it. He's never worked a day in his life in the private sector. He got into politics and now owns three mansions. Freeloading and stealing from the people pays pretty good.

Here. Let's do that the right way.

https://i.imgflip.com/4ouooc.jpg

Capitalism has failed everywhere it was tried, it created a class of proletarians dispossessed of natural resources and the means of production and kept them at service of the bourgeoisie by the threat of impoverishment. Poverty doesn’t have to exist, but it must exist under capitalism. Capitalism doesn’t require giving according to need, it requires producing according to profit, and as a result many go without.

It is a bullshit repeated lie that the hegemonic press keeps touting that capitalism has significantly reduced global poverty, and they use numbers dating back to the 1800s. Two problems with this: one, we didn’t collect data on global poverty until 1981 so everything before that is very unreliable; two, the standard for living in extreme poverty is living on less than $1.90 a day. If you raise the standard to something even slightly more reasonable, $7.40, you find that more people have actually been falling into poverty since 1981, and a majority of the world (about 60%) live below this line. Poverty is rising in the capitalist countries, and the biggest reductions in global poverty come from East Asia, that’s right, China. The socialist country that you said was failing.

It’s also bullshit to say that any of the Marxist-Leninist governments have established communism. None of them have, and none of them probably will because it’s very unlikely that the state will actually wither away. Besides, they won’t willingly lower their guard amid hostile trade with capitalist nations, and embargoes and sanctions and so forth.

National socialism has nothing to do with Marxist socialism, as Hitler said himself. Mussolini abandoned class struggle and proletarian dictatorship for class collaboration, turning syndicalism into national syndicalism, advocating for corporate syndicates. Like Hitler, he suppressed and murdered the socialists in his country.

Oh, It's you again. Here, let me correct that paragraph for you:

Marxism has failed everywhere it was tried, it created a class of proletarians dispossessed of natural resources and the means of production and kept them at service of the bourgeoisie by the threat of impoverishment. Poverty doesn’t have to exist, but it must exist under Marxism. Marxism doesn’t truly give according to need, it takes from the people and keeps the money for the oligarchs, and as a result everyone goes without.

That is the actual truth. Not some blind fairy tale about a utopia that cannot exist.

Governments attract malignant narcissists into leadership positions. All governments, even the ones that are considered benevolent. Marxism takes all political power from the individual and concentrates it into the oligarch, the central planners. The individual cannot be trusted with free will. The great lie of Marxism is that they purposely confuse people and collective. So when Americans hear the world people they think the individual. But what the Marxists have always meant is the collective. The central planners know what is best for the collective. It is a one size fits all approach.

Labor is no longer rewarded for productivity, but instead quotas are enforced because no one has any reason to achieve success. Their lives are not going to improve for excelling at their jobs so people just work and care nothing about their quotas until the entire system falls apart.

I am saying all of this because despite all of your attempts to run down the free market, and especially dragging China into it, is just complete and utter crap. The Chinese people are not getting rich, just the government.

But don't worry. The Great Reset will make all of your wildest dreams come true. They are building a new 21st century kind of fascism. I know, communists hate fascists but isn't that just like looking in a mirror and hating what you see? Fascism was born out of Marxism. The government still controls the means of production, they just let the business owners who run those corporations keep running them but under strict government control. The end result is the same. So you should be very ecstatic right about now. Yay!!! Your side is winning (at the moment). You get to have the government do all of your thinking for you. And as the World Economic Forum said, "you will own nothing and you will be happy".

You basically just said “no, you” by saying Marxism is capitalism, when that makes zero historical sense. Not like you know any history, but still.

If you pay any attention, you would know that wages have stagnated in the US since the 1970s and that wage increases do not keep up with price increases. New generations are continuing to earn less than the previous. A global survey of workers said they don’t believe working harder will result in a better life. This is all capitalism, not communism.

To say fascism came out of Marxism is a huge stretch. Is it really fair to say that someone who was a socialist, then became an anti-socialist and based his ideology on suppressing working class movements was “born out of Marxism”? Not at all.

The labor movement is still fighting a significant uphill battle. We’re making small steps, unionizing Starbucks stores and the first Amazon warehouse, but it will take time I think for labor to regain its ground. And still we should expect the reaction from the elites to backtrack our progress. To say our side is winning is absurd. Too many people, such as yourself, still believe in the capitalist propaganda and refuse to change this system that is in a crisis and threatening our lives and the planet.

Because it IS you and it makes perfect HISTORICAL sense. Please show me the Marxist utopia that has ever been created? I would really like to know when and where it happened. All I have ever seen is the death, misery and some of the worst poverty mankind has ever had to live through. That is all Marxism has ever done.

Cuba has virtually no homeless. China has high speed rail. Vietnam has one of the most prosperous economies in the world. Your dystopian picture is not reality. There are some genuine criticisms of these governments, but in reality they do a lot more for working people than capitalist governments ever will. Cuba has a higher literacy rate than us. Their child mortality rate is consistently lower than ours because of their universal healthcare.

If the nonsense you just spewed makes any historical sense, then please explain how communism, and not capitalism, created class rule and the proletarian class. Because while people lived communal lifestyles for centuries before the nation states and capitalist governments, they were more egalitarian and were not divided based on class. Capitalism was introduced through the violent seizure of communal and indigenous land, creating a class of capitalist property owners and a dispossessed class of workers.

Whoopty do. China has high speed rail. Does it take you to that empty city China built just to make work for people? How are the Uyghurs doing these days? Are they living comfortably?

What do you define as a prosperous economy? Is everyone living prosperously or is it just the government?

If Cuba has a higher literacy rate then that can only mean that the left has succeeded in dumbing America down.

Did you know that every single advancement in science, medicine, technology and everything else primarily came from capitalism? And the vast majority of those advancements came from the United States of America. None of them came from China, Vietnam or Cuba. Not a single advancement in anything.

It all happened because people thought they could make a better living for their family by making or improving a product or service.

China doesn't offer it's citizens the opportunity to live better by working for themselves. Instead China gives social credits to those who better serve the government. The more inline with the communist government the higher your social credit is. So you can have a better life in China through total submission to the government. Hey, that sounds fun. We should do that everywhere. Oh wait. We are. We have ESG scores that businesses, currently, are volunteering to adhere to. Soon they will be enforced and they will extend to people.

There was a "study" conducted by Marxists and promoted by Michael Moore (where is he lately) that said Cuba has better health care than the US. Like I said earlier, Cuba would be in the dark ages if there was no USA. For that matter, so would the rest of the world. We lead the world in medical innovation. So if that's the case then how on earth can Cuba possibly have better health care than the US. Oh, I know. It's because we've had decades of leftist politicians doing horrible things to the health care industry, driving costs through the roof. Obamacare just made it worse and now fewer people can afford the "Affordable Healthcare Act". Obamacare was purposely designed to fail so that the left could put single payer.

I'm sure you think that if the government runs healthcare life will be perfect, just like how the VA hospitals have been run. So if you think that a government can run a healthcare system at a much lower cost with far better service then apparently you've never been to a DMV. That or you're living in a fantasy world.

Yeah, that just isn’t true… not only is your argument that Cuba succeeds because of the US insane, but Cuba has made innovations and advancements to medicine, particularly in cancer treatments and research. The Cuban economy is less great than it was during the days that it had support from the USSR, and it is largely due to the fact that the United States strangles them with sanctions and a longtime embargo on goods. Cuba prospers in spite of U.S. attempts to sabotage their economy.

Vietnam has seen significant reductions in poverty since the 1990s and even today the capitalist institutions like the IMF and World Bank have had a curious interest in the economic success of the socialist state.

Remember that leftists are a vast minority in the U.S. government. Pretty sure rising healthcare costs and the emboldening of insurance companies has been a bipartisan effort by market-minded politicians. Even Obamacare was a market-based reform. There are some problems with Obamacare, mostly that it doesn’t cover people universally, but there is no denying that it has saved lives and now covers millions more Americans.

It’s strange that you would use the VA as an example of single payer healthcare, rather than the successful implementation of universal healthcare systems in literally every other developed nation on the planet. Somehow the wealthiest nation that has ever existed can’t guarantee healthcare to all its citizens.

If ANY country in the world, Marxist or otherwise, has come up with a new innovation it is all built on the back of work that got them to that level by the United States.

It is possible that innovation can happen in a Marxist state. Nazi Germany gave us aspirin. It can happen. But what I am talking about is the number of innovations. There is just no question that capitalism has produced the most innovations in the shortest amount of time then at any other time in the history of mankind. You just cannot argue against that.

The IMF and the World Bank are what???? You can't be serious. They are working with the WEF and the UN to bring about the Great Reset. The Great Reset's sole purpose is the destruction of capitalism.

"Remember that leftists are a vast minority in the U.S. government."

I have heard that is true but our elections always, ever since Reagan, have always seemed close. So if what you say is true then Trump won in 2020 because the left has been cheating for the last 30 years (actually it has been the last 60 years).

"Pretty sure rising healthcare costs and the emboldening of insurance companies has been a bipartisan effort"

You're not wrong there. However, where you are wrong is that it was market based. I read a few years ago about a medical clinic who came up with an idea of having their patients pay $75 per month and it would cover all services that clinic offered including all prescriptions. When the insurance companies found out about it they sued claiming the clinic cannot be insurance company. The case was settled to where prescriptions were no long included in that service. The insurance companies went to the government and the government shut the clinic's subscription service completely down.

THAT IS NOT CAPITALISM. Capitalism the Insurance industries would not be able to do anything against that clinic. And as the idea from one clinic spread soon the insurance industry would either have to make drastic changes or go the way of the dinosaur.

The insurance industry has been heavily regulated by the government (in prelude to single payer) for decades. That has been the reason why our healthcare sucks in America.

When I say single payer I am referring to universal healthcare. Any healthcare that is administered by the government. And it is NOT successful in the rest of the world. It is only successful if you like waiting months for serious conditions. The cost is hidden in taxes.

In case you haven't heard, you need a different argument.

Cringe + blue pilled + L + radio + kys

False

Communism will succeed. You just have to sacrifice enough poor people.

And rich and middle cases. Just people in general then everyone is poor therefore no one is poor.

Yup. The only other group besides poor people would be the bureaucrats at the top that are always livin large.

What do you mean by capitalism?

They mean the straw man university professors have built in their minds of what capitalism is. They think someone who is rich has always been rich and will always be rich until you murder them and take all their stuff to the pawn shop.
I could be reading into that a little bit too much.

There aren't universally accepted definitions of "communism," "socialism," or "capitalism." Even purported believers in each disagree as to what they mean. I don't really take seriously arguments based on those terms, as they mostly boil down to semantics.

socialism= public owning of the means of production
capitalism= private owning of the means of production

I suppose it does depend on who you ask. You say Communism I say evil, You ask them communism they say good.

It goes deeper than that. What you'd call "communism" they'd call "state capitalism," and what they'd call "communism" many would call "anarchy."

I'd call it doomed to fail.

I find it unfortunate that so many people who identify as "conservatives" and also people who identify as "leftists" seem to be mainly concerned with making specific words cause negative emotional reactions. It doesn't matter what the words mean, so long as people hate whatever they're applied to.

The thing is these 2 sides have different definitions of words. So there is no basis of which to find common ground. Each side has grown into the antithesis of the other.

That's what they think.

Plus, I guarantee this person absolutely adores big government when it comes to the police and the military. But giving healthcare to poor people is where she draws the line.