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I'm lying

I'm lying | WHAT ARE YOUR VIEWS ON LYING? WHAT CONSTITUTES AS A LIE AND IS IT EVER JUSTIFIED? | image tagged in lies | made w/ Imgflip meme maker
1,107 views 27 upvotes Made by Captain_Scar 4 years ago in The_Think_Tank
28 Comments
[deleted]
4 ups, 4y,
1 reply
Lying is sometimes needed and sometimes is not. If you need to lie to protect someone or for a good reason then do it. If you lie for your own gain then it’s not ok
3 ups, 4y,
1 reply
I try to never lie (I don't always succeed) even when trying to protect someone. In cases like that I say things that would be considered deceptive but not necessarily a straight up lie. I'm not entirely sure how to describe it.
1 up, 4y
ik what ur talking about lol
3 ups, 4y,
1 reply
If you are hiding Jews in your basement and Nazis come looking for them, you could be justified in saying there are no Jews in your house.
2 ups, 4y,
1 reply
I would say so, yes. I did hear that Mr. Tenbaum would actually answer them honestly and say they were under the dining room table (they were in a secret room) but the nazis didn't find them? I'm not sure if that's true or not but I know the idea's out there.
[deleted]
1 up, 4y,
1 reply
1 up, 4y
I'd have to agree
2 ups, 4y
Well, I don't consider lying a necessarily bad thing. To me it is much more important to not be an a**hole to people who haven't been an a**hole towards you. I would never lie to hurt someone and I would never conciously spread false information. But other than that I don't consider the truth to be inherently good and always favorable. Of course, there are the extreme cases like telling someone who is dying they're gonna be ok. The middle ground is a bit harder to categorize entirely. But if you follow the "not being more of an a**hole than necessary"-rule I think you're fine in my book.
3 ups, 4y,
1 reply
When you say "I never lie", I'd say you are lying, and stating a fact in the process.

Of course, there are a few things to be taken in order. If I told you that I am a redcap, I am lying, since I'm not, but if you believe that, and tell that to somebody else, are you then a liar? Not really since you merely told other people what you believed to be true. You get a bit of my reasoning.

I once read an essay about prejudice believe that gypsies lie, however the essay explains that in the ancient traditions of gypsies betrayal is considered the ultimate act of evil, and if a lie can then be used to prevent them from betraying somebody, and to be honest, betraying people is a bad thing too. Now I cannot verify the content of that essay, but for the good of this comment, let's assume it's correct.

In a general sense I hate lying, but sometimes lying is needed, like I stated above in order to prevent betrayal, but sometimes there are really things people are not allowed to know for very good reasons, and then a lie can sometimes distract them from those things. In Dutch we call that "Een leugentje om bestwil", which is hard to translate, but roughly attempting it comes down to "A little lie for the better". Not very elegant, but sometimes better than telling the truth with horrible consequences.

Of course, some lies come forth because we want people to lie. In politics we see that a lot. Perhaps you heard the news that Greece was in big trouble during the 2008 crisis, and that Europe was not really willing to help Greece. The Dutch prime minister Mark Rutte promised "Geen cent meer naar Griekenland" (lit. No more cent to Greece), but every economist could tell that if Rutte lived up to that promise the world economy would have gone bankrupt, and that he didn't want that on his name, so that it was a lie from the start. Why did he still make that promise then? Because if he didn't people wouldn't vote for him! They demanded that promise even though that would never be an option.

This also shows that when we are being lied to, that we also should wonder if the liar was to blame or that we are to blame ourselves. After all, we have the tendency to only listen to what we want to hear, and not to things the way they really are, as the latter is mostly not very enjoyable... Mostly the truth sucks big way. This is also why lies rule the public opinion rather than the truth. (And yes, this is one of the weak spots in democracy... unfortunately).
3 ups, 4y,
1 reply
If you don't know that your lying because someone has told you something I wouldn't consider that as really lying because as far as you know, that IS truth. That's why I hate lies so much because if you're surrounded by liars you can't really know what the truth is.

I will say that in the case where someone I trust tells me something or does something that they don't want other people to know and someone else asks me about it I will lie about having ever heard about such a thing because if I even admit to knowing something that could open up a lot of problems.
I'm not sure what exactly I think about it but I know I do it.
3 ups, 4y,
1 reply
I see in your first paragraph you got my reasoning there.

And the second paragraph is exactly the point where I was getting at in my gypsy story. I think both betrayal and lying could be bad, but sometimes you must choose either to betray somebody by telling something that was supposed to be a secret, or by lying in order to make sure the secret remains safe with you. When choosing between the two "evils" I guess lying can mostly be the best option then. It really shows that lying is not something to judge in a black-white-view.
3 ups, 4y
Agreed
[deleted]
1 up, 4y,
1 reply
Lying is of course a sin, but I think secrets are sometimes okay.
0 ups, 4y
okay
[deleted]
1 up, 4y,
1 reply
A lie is anything that is not the truth. A lie is NEVER justified, even when used to protect someone from the truth. If you withhold the truth from someone, but never present an alternate truth because their character suggests that they would react to it in a poor way, save the truth for a good time and then explain why
1 up, 4y,
1 reply
or just don't say anything...
[deleted]
1 up, 4y
Yeah, but you could also cause more harm than good when the very person you are trying to protect by doing this later finds out the truth and that you didn't tell then, because everything in darkness comes into the light. It's a situation that could potentially be worse than the one you believe to be true, besides the fact you should never assume
1 up, 4y,
1 reply
I try to lie as much as possible. Jk, I usually try not to lie (don’t always do though) though I feel a little guilty after lying.
1 up, 4y
Yeah, same XD
1 up, 4y,
1 reply
To spare someone's feelings, for example.

The key component to a lie is intent to deceive. Have you wondered why, when swearing in a witness in a court proceeding, they say "do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?" If you say some things that are truthful but leave other things out, you have violated the second principle, and if you say some things that are truthful but add in untruths, you have violated the third.
1 up, 4y
Yes, and that's some interesting thinking on the second part
1 up, 4y,
1 reply
I lie a lot in my day to day life and are very successful and fluent at it, but I believe lying is justified as in point of view, say you are lying to protect one person, that would be justified in your POV, but the other perspective as the person you lied to getting told the truth that they lied to you is hurtful, even for so if you trusted them closely and can impact the relationship between both parties.
1 up, 4y,
1 reply
yea, so don't make it a habit
1 up, 4y
Yeah
1 up, 4y,
1 reply
Ok when you need it. Not ok when you don't need it.
0 ups, 4y
ok
[deleted]
0 ups, 4y,
1 reply
1 up, 4y
No spam, please stop. Your comment is being deleted.
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WHAT ARE YOUR VIEWS ON LYING? WHAT CONSTITUTES AS A LIE AND IS IT EVER JUSTIFIED?