can't get over this insane logic.

All sane nations 'rig' their immigration system to benefit their own people . . . except for when the leftists infesting them gain power . . . then those leftists usually TRY to destroy their own nation with utterly insane immigration policies.

please, tell me how taking rights away from your own citizens is supposed to benefit them. i beg of you. plus, what's the point of making your country seem like the "land of opportunities" if you won't allow people who weren't born here to have said opportunities? and i'm not even trying to prove you wrong—i am asking a genuine question. it'd be wonderful if i could get a neutral, concise answer.

taking rights away from your own citizens

What right did our own citizens lose?

maybe let's start with the biggest, basic rights we should have as humans: safety, equality, and necessities... but i don't know, just tell me if i'm wrong about that!!

And which of our citizens lost those?

well, weren't you guys mad over losing your right to carry firearms? i'm sure the right was fuming over losing their right to defend themselves... or am i crazy?

Not sure, but what state took the right to carry away?

why don't you tell me?

You are the one that claimed it happened. I’m just asking for the name of the state.

california, maryland, minnesota, new jersey, and new york.

See, that wasn’t so hard was it…

Your entire premise is false.

It's not difficult to gain citizenship because it's intended to be some kind of impossible dream. It's difficult because we want people to come here who really want to be here and who are the type of people who do things the right way (as in the legal way) instead of just showing up at our door and thinking they're entitled to walk in and take whatever they want. And no, we are far from unique in the family of nations who have the very same attitude.

We want people to come here who share our ideals, such as working for a living, and not breaking laws. Of course since libtards don't share those ideals, they've proven they're happy to let anyone in, AND also treat them better than they do our own citizens.

i definitely understand where you're coming from, and i wish i could express that online in a way that doesn't seem sarcastic. however, i know many, many immigrants who have come to america legally, did everything they're supposed to do, share "american" ideals and beliefs—and it still took between 1-10 years, sometimes over a decade, for them to gain a green card, which isn't citizenship, i'm sure you know. plus, having a green card doesn't grant immunity to being deported for any reason. and i do agree that, as an immigrant/non-us citizen, you shouldn't be able to stay if you are breaking laws. however, can we agree that people being deported for reasons other than crime committing is kind of, i don't know, iffy at best?

"...can we agree that people being deported for reasons other than crime committing is kind of, i don't know, iffy at best?"

Maybe. But you're not saying why these folks are being deported. You've said people are being deported for "reasons other than crime committing". But to be able to answer your question, I'd need to know what are the reasons that you're referring to, if there were not laws that were broken. With that info, I might agree with you.

What I think most can agree on is precisely what you stated, which in is that in effect, the legal immigration process is broken. Meaningful reform of our immigration process needs to be part of the solution to the overall immigration issue. However, for years my position has been that we need to secure the border first, then work on reform. That assumes one has to be done last. Ideally both could happen at the same time, but politicians don't seem to be the sharpest or most efficient when it comes to getting smart things done.

And btw, my wife is a legal immigrant and had to jump through all of the hoops you're talking about. Which is a pretty big reason why that particular legal immigrant has zero empathy for those trying to circumvent the overly long process and cut in line.

apologies for the late response! what i was implying by "crime committing" was malintent—but i very clearly did not say that or make it obvious at all, so i apologize for that! but i meant that some immigrants get deported for overstaying, which violates their visa and *is* considered a crime. but my belief was that it isn't often done maliciously. again, i apologize for not making my point clear. i also appreciate you for your willingness to actually discuss this topic instead of resorting to insults like many people on this stream. please correct if anything i've said is inaccurate!

I thought you might be talking about things that seem like minor issues or minor rule breaking to some or even most, but I didn't want to ramble on if that wasn't the case. And while we may not agree on all aspects of immigration and probably even fewer issues in general, I'm with you that civil discourse is a welcome change of pace. Hell, on the mighty imgflip it's practically a breath of fresh air!

To your point, I think once the larger aspects of the immigration issue are resolved, then some fine tuning on things like you mentioned would be a good idea. I can't say that I agree over staying a visa should be considered a minor thing, but it should be in the discussion. Because you're right, most who do that are not malicious. But some are. Dealing with making that determination and all the other issues you're thinking about could be worked out if people are willing to compromise.

But first, I think we all have to let out the hot steam from under our collars on this issue. AND, we need a permanent, codified solution. Otherwise, every time there's a new POTUS, they could undo what their predecessor did with EO's. Then it just goes back and forth and nothing is permanently solved.

i agree with your points! really, like you said, things could just be solved if people are willing to compromise. unfortunately, as long as we continue to label and separate ourselves, seeing everyone else as the enemy, we won't come close to understanding each other.

and we most definitely need permanent solutions. the whiplash i'm getting from adjustments & executive orders being announced and recalled and thrown about is insane. even looking at previous presidencies—clinton, bush, obama, trump, biden—so much has changed from the moment they were inaugurated to when they resigned.