I wonder who the 33rd could be

We'll never know

Sorry, out of principle I'd rather let a truly competitive private market handle something whenever possible. Let's go for that rather than expanding government yet again.

Ideally, a competitive market would keep prices low, but in reality, people are bankrupted left right and centre. Let's do a though experiment. I'll assume you are relatively well off, but in what financial state would you be if you suffered from pancreatic cancer? Just about anyone in, say, Canada, England, Sweden, France, Germany, Scotland, and Italy, could say that they would be just as well off as before, but in the US, people have to beg others not to call an ambulance because they can't afford it. Universal healthcare allows people to get treatment as soon as possible, no questions asked, with often the option of going private if you can afford it.

A friend's sister had to drive herself to the ER whilst bleeding out because her insurance from her job at the hospital didn't cover ambulance rides!

I just don't understand how people can argue in favor of this system.

Neither do I

False logic you're applying. Not everyone in universal systems gets treatment quickly and not everyone in the U.S has to beg someone else to call an ambulance.

The issue, I think, is that you're taking my statement and assuming I think the system as-is is good. It's NOT a free market right now, so why would you act like it is?

I know. One of the main downsides of the universal system is that people go to hospitals for minor problems, increasing wait times. However, if the wait times properly affect your health in a negative way, you get priority. In a universal system, you don't get denied treatment because of your money. I know that not everyone in the US is begging others not to call an ambulance, but the fact that there are still people doing it is pretty bad. People are forced to find second rate treatment simply because they are too poor to get anything better. There's a reason the other developed countries have adopted this system.

Sure, but the old adage of, "Don't do something just because everybody else is doing it." still holds true.

The U.S has always been a nation where we try to accomplish something ourselves and in as loose a manner as possible. Until we actually create a free market and see what it does I refuse to keel over and say, "Eh, let the government do it."

Yes, but there's a reason people are doing it. Look into that reason, and give me another way to solve that problem

First, actually de-regulate the market and make it truly competitive. Lift the geographical restrictions. Make it it so you either have the best plan or you lose customers. Then apply normal government oversight (I.E, banning market collusion to ensure all companies don't agree to jack insulin prices, for example).

The cost of healthcare would plummet (because gaugers would be undercut by someone with a more competitive plan), the accessibility would skyrocket (as companies scramble to attract as many customers as possible), and we keep that sector of the economy private.

You'll either be paying your money to a private insurer or as extra taxes to the government. I'd rather support a business.

what? Yes much better the doctor makes 1 million a year instead of just 500k or that the drugs cost 1500 a year instead of 20..... wtf?

What about a truly competitive market necessitates price gouging like that?

Some things should not be sold for profit, health care is one of those thing. Prison cells another.

You don't get to decide whether something should be a viable private career or not. Want a public option or other ways to ensure everyone has access to basic care? I'm all for it. But that doesn't give us a societal license to tell someone they can't try making money by helping others.

You forget the basic rule that drives a truly free market; you only make money if you do a good job. If providers and insurers actually had to compete for consumers, they'd lower prices and increase benefits in an attempt to attract more customers. If people aren't happy, they'll go to someone else. Therefore you have to be better than everyone else, which means you're not gouging prices (as is seen today).

Does that mean I think healthcare shouldn't be treated differently than any other sector? No. Of course not. Because of its nature we need extra regulation and vigilance on the part of the government to ensure abuse doesn't occur. But the notion that people can't help themselves and that government alone is the only alternative is one I reject wholly.

What diffence does it make if a nurses check comes from Bezos Inc, or the US Treasury? Why do you think private business is the 'good guy"???? You should meet Martin Skrelli

Why would you think supporting a free market means I'd like everything monopolized under Bezos?

You are smarter than to draw that non sequitur of a conclusion from my statement.

that's unfair to working class people who worked their butts off to pay their medical bills, while people now get everything for free.

And freeing slaves was unfair to the black people who had to work their butts off to not get brutally killed, whilst now they have equal rights. You could make that same argument to all progress. When progress is made, there will always be people who were worse off and didn't get to profit from the new system. But it's still better to let people profit from it than to not let people profit because others didn't get to. If we had that mentality, we would be saying that using spears is unfair to all the other cavemen who were eaten by bears. Those people died pretty quickly

you make a good point there, but in order to pay for all this stuff, the tax payer's taxes would be sky rocketing to the point, where the tax payers couldn't afford to pay their taxes.

That's not how taxes work

Nope, every other developed country proves that wrong.

So, because you suffered, everyone else should suffer?

How about you get angry at the people making you work your butt off to access healthcare not the people who need to access healthcare?

You know they benefit from it too?