Deja Vu much?

I probably missed a few.

You're one of my favs on this site.... but this Carson meme is one of the best! I had to copy and share with friends from Canada,... to the west coast! =) It's GREAT!

Thanks bro! I uploaded the template too if you have any ideas.

It is a two way street full of assumptions and accusations that do nothing but alienate groups farther and farther away from eachother. I've been accused of living with parents, receiving a college education vacant of accounting & economics. When in reality I started working at 14, full time by 16, obtained an associates in Medical office systems and started my career climb in a federal government job. Only to have it all taken away when I needed FMLA for my Bipolar Son when I found myself in a battle to just keep him alive and from hurting or endangering himself. That is additional to my son that is Autistic diagnosed in preschool. They say god does not give you more than you can handle. Well that is not true. Nothing is fair everything is a struggle with more struggle on top. I just like to be on here to laugh and joke because I need laughter in my life. I'm really so tired of having the same fallacies repeated as factual though. I vote democrat because yes I do care about other people, no I do not like lazy shiftless people, but most of the people I know work and work hard and have not a damn thing to show for it. Trickle down was a lie, you hear from your own candidate, Trump, it is bought and paid for, democracy is a facade. There are rich people that employ Americans that give back to communities, that work and take pride in being socially responsible but there are more that take their jobs where they can pay pennies, that violate waste laws, that bribe congressmen and charge unaffordable amounts for our needs. There are banks working every angle to kill us with fees and insurances that let people die to protect their profit margins, you habe been shown federal budgets amd can see for yourself where tax dollars are going and it is less than 3% to social welfare programs. Congress just refused a Social Security cost of living increase for seniors and then gave themselves a raise. Big companies are trying to privatize all of our water, can you imagine once that happens what that will cost? A key element to living. As long as we keep the bickering going we are conquered already because not one thing will change it will only get worse.

LOL why do I get labeled as a Trump supporter??? He was never my candidate. I also called you non of those things in your image below, in fact I have always treated you with nothing but respect even though I know you and I don't agree on quite a few issues. You did nothing with that meme response except prove my point. If you had taken the time to read any of the back and forth that went on in the conversation with delirious you would have seen I am not anti-social safety nets, I am anti graf, corruption and fraud that goes on within it. I am also pro-pathway out of the hell having to rely on social programs would be. Anyway thanks for the attacks.

Oh, I'm sorry John. I didn't mean you specifically, just the character of Johnny Carson. Or Jonny Conservative. I just meant that there is a lot of mame calling going on both sides.

I did read your replys, I upvoted many of them too. I was not trying to attack you at all I'm sorry if it felt that way. Through our discussions, we have found that you cannot judge a book by political party. I would never call you any of those names either. I thought we were just speaking in general on the tensions that are ongoing between parties.

Its cool, the name/names caused the confusion. We have had good conversations in the past so that really did surprise me! I am though, and I'm sure just is no surprise to you a conservative so in some ways it still does apply, Conservatives DO have a heart, I (and others) don't want to see an end to programs that help those in need, but we also know the way things are progressing there will VERY soon come a time where there is NOTHING left for anyone. Barnie Frank while possibly well-intentioned did more to put people on the streets than any one person I can think of by pushing the deregulating how home loans were made resulting in economic disaster. Everyone would love free college, but it is not possibly when the debt, not deficit, is growing in the trillions of dollars. Its maddening to me to hear politicians talk about giving more and NEVER talking about fixing, cleaning up or tightening up the current system.

I would like to see that too, starting with booting the self serving members of Congress and taking away their fat retirement plans and replacing with something more reflective of their public service. War Veterans should have lifetime provisions not career politicians. That powerball lottery amount actually made me sick when it was pointed out that dividing it up between all citizens was still well over a million each. Apply that to the national debt. I do not hate rich people I hate greed, excess, corruption, buying power, special treatment, different laws, debauchery, and all the spoiled narcissistic affluenza affected prodigy. I hate that homes are empty but people are homeless as rental rates climb. I know that you never said Trump was your candidate yet it appears Republicans are stuck with him and that is due to the very corruptable electoral process that, as a media mogul, he admittedly knew exactly how to use to his advantage. He claims to want to put an end to the faulty election process that gives us only bought and paid for candidates as well as paid for media propaganda or support, while at the same time exploiting it to get himself what he wants. Like you I most likely will be faced with a distasteful candidate. We all wish for more options yet we are all powerless to make that happen. What does that powerlessness truly say about the rights or votes of citizens?

Well after 8 hours now of trying to remove a virus and now finally having to restore my system to be rid of it, I'm voting for the 1st candidate that offers a death penalty for hackers.

[image deleted]Extradition & Capital Punishment

There are a lot of smart people here so I think this is the best place to talk about delusion. My question is when I encounter a delusional person who thinks that they are superior, and believes that their opinion is more credible than anyone else, should I take the initiative to confront them to attempt to teach them that they have a mental disorder, or should I ignore it in the hopes they will figure it out in their own time? I am only interested in the science of the subject of delusion, not opinions.

I don't think anyone is going to convince anyone else that they are insane on a website. I just usually end it when I start feeling like I am doing brain damage to myself by continuing. Then again many have referred to me as delusional.

lol i guess i am tryn to learn a little about myself in the process, I am DeliRiOuS you know

I like that response! I am curious, I am guessing you are younger, just from some of our previous conversation... fair guess?

middle aged but I am a sympathetic person so I can channel how i would feel in other people shoes

Sorry about the slow response but sleep and work and stuff, you know how it is. I had you pegged as a little younger just by the passion in your position with the Bernie college plan, I thought you might have a vested interest.

Education is very important and we must invest in our future if we want to remain competitive in the world.

Agreed, but every time the government says "invest" all muscles in my body spasm.

I feel you, I cringe when I hear a conservative say lazy people want free stuff just because some one wants to help the poor.

There are plenty of lazy people out there and people gaming the system. Until that is minimized or eliminated the government should not get any more areas to manage. Everyone wants to say conservatives are heartless and this just isn't true. Conservatives want to see those TRULY in need get the help and we could do even more for those if it all wasn't so badly mismanaged. At the rate the government is going ALL programs cannot be sustained without taxing the money sources out of competition or into oblivion. If you were to honestly think about it you have never heard a conservative say that there should not be social programs. What you have heard are ideas to make them more efficient, and sustainable.

The people gaming the system is not the poor, it is the rich, because they have the power to corrupt the minds of the masses.

You will have to expand on that reply for it to make any sense to me, it sounds like you are saying the rich are gaming social programs like welfare and ssi?

money buys alliances and they influence masses people with campaigns to protect their power

You evaded my question though. I am curious if you have ever witnessed 1st hand what a billionaire can do not only for his community and employees but also various charities.

the fact is that the community it self provides the majority of commerce that supports the life styles of the people in said community, there is plenty of evidence, i can link

Really??? Tell me more about thriving Detroit, Pittsburgh and how well off West Virginia is with the coal business being regulated out of existence.

yes with masses out of work the community will fail

"Labor force and employment data provide important information on the size and stability of a local economy as measured by the local workforce." http://fyi.uwex.edu/downtown-market-analysis/understanding-the-market/local-regional-economic-analysis/

I'm certainly not defending Wal-mart which I classify as a scourge, but the Waltons are not the only billionaires out there. Walmart made all its money by having other stores have to shut down and by putting American manufacturers out of business. Walmart got all kinds of help from the Clintons and will continue to if she gets elected. Since you do dislike billionaires so much, I am curious where you do stand on that since the Clintons if you combine Bill and Hillary's net worth along with their foundation it does add up to just shy of 1 billion dollars all with maybe 20-30 full time employees. Do you think they use tax "loopholes" aka deductions or "shelters; like a foundation or something....maybe???

first you assume a lot, i never said that i dislike any1. I class people into 3 categories, good, bad , and indifferent, so there are good billionaires, bad, and indifferent. Loopholes are a big problem, hiding money in off shore accounts is another, substitutes is another, but I am no expert but these are all built into laws so that the middle class pays way more than the rich have to, and that I think is unfair.

Maybe I do assume too much, but its the only thing left when you continually deflect. I even tried to go with you on the last deflection only to end up in a circle, but I will try to stay with you here. I hear people talk about the loopholes but I have never heard them state the ones they feel are bad. I may actually agree but I haven't filled out a long form in years so there may be ones I am unaware of?

I understand what your point is when you ask your questions, so address that point

Address which point??????? Any time I try to get on the same page with you to discuss, I get nowhere. I've asked questions to see from what angle you are coming from only to go off in a different direction. I even agreed with you a couple of times. I don't know if your avoiding answering them because you think I'm loading up to shoot down your reply or if you just don't know what you really think. I want to think that you have more behind what you are saying but I can't find a way to get to it.

It is true I have enjoyed our banter, and I know you are intelligent. I am not that good at typing, and I may not be able to explain myself very well, but there is a lot of misdirection being used by both sides of our political parties. Our system is corrupted to take advantage of the American people while fleecing the pockets of the powerful. I have been an Independent sense 1996, I just want to be a voice of fact, and not conjecture.

I understand what responses you are trying to illicit on the context of your question, and I have attempted to state my position on the subject in question.

I am not sure if you are following anything I have said, because I feel that I responded to all of you inqureis

So what are the problem loopholes? Is the only one offshore banking?

Loopholes, subsidies, and hiding money are all ways that people evade paying their fare share. Loopholes are fine print built into the tax code so that people with the resources can avoid paying the same rates as the majority of America, and it is a form of welfare for the wealthy. Subsidies are grants in form of capital, also a form of welfare, and I hate when people complain about helping the poor when the ultra rich are getting more welfare.

This why I give up on so many discussions, you went from one non-specific (loopholes) to two (subsidies), and then explained them to me as if I am unfamiliar with their definitions. What I was asking for were specifics.
You're shooting at anything that moves instead of identifying your enemy and taking aim. Because of this anyone else who isn't shooting randomly will never truly understand if you are an enemy or an ally. When you are shooting randomly many will assume the latter.
I really do try to keep an open mind in all discussions but all I know still after a day and a half is that you hate loopholes and now subsidies because you feel they take away from the poor.

again I think I have been quite clear, I am not sure what you want from me

But you have to understand that without specifics it IS conjecture as facts ARE specifics. I agree fully that both parties misdirect constantly. That is their job. Ours as the public is to know what we are against and why (facts, figures, stats). The vast majority cast a vote without knowing more then 2 or 3 facts about their candidate. They go with the soundbite that made them feel good instead of understanding who and what they are casting a vote for. I'll just leave you with this thought, I can promise you that you used a minimum of 3 "loopholes" on YOUR taxes this year.

i can support all of my claims with evidence that is public record. The complexity of the tax code is another way big money has manipulated the system to benefit them over the American people.

Please, stay with the topic, you were responding to a comment I made regarding social programs. I still fail to see how you are tying this in, its just a generalized democrat talking point that is useless in conversation as it doesn't pinpoint anything, clarify or even state a position other than saying rich are evil.

My point is: it's not the poor who take advantage of the system, it is the rich who lobby and pay lawyers to write laws and to find loopholes to hide their money, to avoid paying their fair share.

I have had the pleasure of knowing several very rich people in my life. Each had accountants that made sure they paid as little taxes (legally) as possible. Each dumped way more into the community than the taxes they saved on. Each provided jobs and commerce that kept local community economies going. The biggest issue I have with the left is the generalizations used to paint all business owners as greedy rich tax cheats perpetuating a class envy environment to divide the electorate. I have to work now, but happily will continue later.

ok i am not talking about upper middle class, they are taxed a lot. I referring to the top 10%, and t to a heavier extent 1%

I don't ask this to be condescending in any way, but have you every worked for one of that 1% and paid close attention to what they were involved with?

the middle class pays a much greater portion of their income to taxes than the rich, the tax code is all the evidence one needs

no i have never worked for walmart but I don't need to, to know their employees need welfare to survive.

I'm not sure if I'm understanding this comment correctly, but some people do have opinions that are more credible than others. Truth is objective, so not all opinions are equally valid. Just because someone holds their opinion to be more credible than the opinions of others isn't necessarily in and of itself a sign of a problem.

The point is the delusion of feeling more credible with out being educated or the facts to back up said opinion.