Unpopular Opinion Puffin

But I'm tired of people equating Christianity and Islam as if they are the same. Islam, Judaism and Christianity get lumped together as Abrahamic religions and so seen homogenously when in fact Islam is radically different from both in its scripture and world outlook and mode of spread.

Muslim outrage huh. OK ... let's do a little historical review. Just some lowlights:
* Muslims fly commercial airliners into buildings in New York City. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslim officials block the exit where school girls are trying to escape a burning building because their faces were exposed. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslims cut off the heads of three teenaged girls on their way to school in Indonesia. A Christian school. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslims murder teachers trying to teach Muslim children in Iraq. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslims murder over 80 tourists with car bombs outside cafes and hotels in Egypt. No Muslim outrage.
* A Muslim attacks a missionary children's school in India. Kills six. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslims slaughter hundreds of children and teachers in Beslan, Russia. Muslims shoot children in the back. No Muslim outrage.
* Let's go way back. Muslims kidnap and kill athletes at the Munich Summer Olympics. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslims fire rocket-propelled grenades into schools full of children in Israel. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslims murder more than 50 commuters in attacks on London subways and busses. Over 700 are injured. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslims massacre dozens of innocents at a Passover Seder. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslims murder innocent vacationers in Bali. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslim newspapers publish anti-Semitic cartoons. No Muslim outrage
* Muslims are involved, on one side or the other, in almost every one of the 125+ shooting wars around the world. No Muslim outrage.
* Muslims beat the charred bodies of Western civilians with their shoes, then hang them from a bridge. No Muslim outrage.
* Newspapers in Denmark and Norway publish cartoons depicting Mohammed. Muslims are outraged.

Dead children. Dead tourists. Dead teachers. Dead doctors and nurses. Death, destruction and mayhem around the world at the hands of Muslims .. no Muslim outrage ... but publish a cartoon depicting Mohammed with a bomb in his turban and all hell breaks loose.
Come on, is this really about cartoons? They're rampaging and burning flags. They're looking for Europeans to kidnap. They're threatening innkeepers and generally raising holy Muslim hell not because of any outrage over a cartoon. They're outraged because it is part of the Islamic jihadist culture to be outraged. You don't really need a reason. You just need an excuse. Wandering around, destroying property, murdering children, firing guns into the air and feigning outrage over the slightest perceived insult is to a jihadist what tailgating is to a Steeler's fan.
I know and understand that these bloodthirsty murderers do not represent the majority of the world's Muslims. When, though, do they become outraged? When do they take to the streets to express their outrage at the radicals who are making their religion the object of worldwide hatred and ridicule? Islamic writer Salman Rushdie wrote of these silent Muslims in a New York Times article three years ago. "As their ancient, deeply civilized culture of love, art and philosophical reflection is hijacked by paranoiacs, racists, liars, male supremacists, tyrants, fanatics and violence junkies, why are they not screaming?"
Indeed. Why not?

I understand, I'm not the best one to be talking though. People will get offended over anything on the internet.

If you can't spell "fascists" you probaby also can't define it.

but i can notice one if he speaks to me

You sir just started a religion war.

Seems to me, it actually isn't a war yet!
This is new...

Yup, at least not politics!

Pick your poison: Religious or political flame war?

It's a bit of a challenge for me to accept the argument that Christianity is just as bad, if not worse, because of something that happened a thousand years ago-like the Crusades. Or events several thousand years ago when Christianity was not yet a religion. Many of the same people claim that Islam is a religion of peace. They have no regard for history (Muslims committed terrible acts during the Crusades too and had a violent beginning) and the fact that it is in the name of Islam that people are having their heads cut off simply for disagreeing with Islam, women are being raped and sold into slavery, buildings are being bombed, and homosexuals are being thrown off buildings.

Exactly what I thought. When these days do you see mass murder/ kidnapping/ stoning being committed in the name of Jesus or Yahweh? Granted there are the crazy fundamentalists in America that handle deadly snakes and wave Bibles around but I have yet to see them turn violent to the extent Islam has. Fundamentalist Islam is highly violent, one only has to read the Qu'ran to see the plethora of violent, aggressive and intolerant verses it incites.

Granted there are dodgy verses in both the Old and New Testament, but even Jews don't follow the Levitical instructions anymore and the teachings of Jesus are in direct opposition to what Islam teaches.

Many of the "dodgy" verses you mention in the Old and New Testaments are that way simply because there's been a loss in translation from original Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic writings to German; then to English. There's also a lot that is a difference in culture. If one truly studies the Bible, there's more that makes sense than doesn't.

I'm not so sure, didn't they do a comparison between the King James and the oldest manuscripts and find that the accuracy had been preserved quite well, especially in comparison to some of Homer's works? Words such as 'arsenokoitai' which have no clear translation into modern English are intriguing. I remember a famous preacher once saying 'Scripture is like a nose of wax, it can be twisted one way or another.' The Bible has been misused somewhat down the ages to justify various atrocities but the fundamental message of Jesus is still that of peace. Contrast the way Islam was spread, with war, terror or conquest, with the way Christianity was spread, with the first Christians being persecuted and tortured and killed.

You are correct. The translations are accurate. Around 98% accurate to be exact. I think I may have not explained it well, though. I used the term, "translations." It's more context that gets debated. And sometimes there simply aren't words in English that can be translated from languages such as Greek. For example, love has around 7 different meanings in Greek. Whereas there's only one in English. The context of Jesus asking Peter if he loved him three times gets lost. I apologize...I should have explained that better. And yes, the origin of Christianity and Islam couldn't be more different, as are their messages.

Yes I know of eros and agape and I cannot remember the rest but they all represent different relationships between others. People will take verses out of context and that is the root of most misunderstanding about Christianity in the world today. Homophobes who blindly quote the famous Leviticus verse forget that the 613 Mitzvah (laws) are divided into ceremonial, moral and governmental laws. With the coming and sacrifice of Jesus the Ceremonial and governmental laws which were commanded at that time by God to the Israelites to keep the bloodline of Jesus clean are now basically redundant, which is why we do not execute those considered sexually immoral or still offer animal sacrifices anymore.

Cool conversation, but I have to go wash my feet, before I go to bed.

Wait, lemme do that for you ;)

Good conversation.

Post this on the front page
that's great stuff right there

You're thinking of the jihadists
A minority among Islam that became terrorists
Also Jihadists look at all Christianity and all other religions in the same way that you look at them.
to generalize that all Muslims are like that would be to say that all 'Murikans are fat and stupid
And while such is true in this case not every 'Murikan is like that.

You don't understand the point I'm making either, do you? Comparing Christianity and Islam is like comparing apples and oranges. Just because the majority are peaceful it doesn't mean the religion itself is peaceful. The Qu'ran advocates much violence as a core part of its doctrine and mode of spreading Islam. The peaceful muslims of the world are apostate according to the Qu'ran. They are not doing the 'will of allah.' According to the Qu'ran the true muslims of the world are the likes of ISIS, Boko Haram, Hamas ect. I bet most of the people commenting on here defending Islam havn't even read the Qu'ran or any of the Hadiths. Naïve Westerners are shocked at the violence of Islam only because they are ignorant to its true teachings. Hate preaching runs afoul in Mosques and the government does nothing to curb then it wonders why terrorist attacks happen. Wake up!

When Muhamed Died he handed over power to Ali
the Kalifs wanted otherwise and changed the book to justify their actoins
Also what do you have against non-violent Muslims?

I have nothing against non violent muslims themselves, it is the ideology they follow I loathe. As I said before, their own book considers the 'peaceful' muslims apostate, but in reality, how can you say the vast majority of muslims are peaceful when they condone the terrible actions you see by ISIS and other terrorist groups? Look up polls which measure by agreement the actions of ISIS and other groups amongst the population of Islamic countries. You will find that a good fraction agree with what the ''radical'' aspect of Islam are doing so can you truly call them peaceful.

ah, now I see what you mean
well that was a waste of time
it seems we are in agreement

Victim blaming at it's best. I am thoroughly entitled to my opinion but fact remains everybody is responsible for their own actions in this world. This is the equivalent of saying that we shouldn't print pictures of Mohammed because y'know, they have no free will and they will bomb us. They can choose whether to be evil or good; it also doesn't change the fact that many western born muslims have chosen to join ISIS out of choice despite being raised in the very liberal Britain and other western countries and 'tolerated.' The fact remains Islam is and always has been a violent, bloodthirsty moon god death worshipping cult and I don't care who doesn't believe it because its' true.

There are actual Peaceful Muslims out there. It's just the bad ones are the ones who are coming to America now.

I still agree on some level

Where in the New Testament do you read of Jesus slaughtering people for the sake of Christianity? Where ever in the history of Christianity has it been spread by terror and violence, unless it was the violence of pagans inflicted on the early Church?

The Crusades were a response to the Islam encroachment of Christian territory and the forced conversion of Christians by Islamic military forces. See this website for more explanation of that: http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2005/11/the_truth_about_islamic_crusad.html

As for the rest of it, yes, it is shocking and appalling but the thing you are not understanding is that the teachings of Christ were completely against everything you have mentioned on that Condescending Wonka meme. It was a corruption and contrary to teachings of Jesus. What Mohammed did however, was perfectly in line with the teachings of the Qu'ran. Have you ever read the Qu'ran. Christianity at its heart is peaceful, Islam teaches to spread Islam by conquering and murdering. Christianity is against racism, sexism and all those other negative acts. Islam endorses and encourages it. See the difference?

Evidently you haven't read the Quran. Sure extremist like Bin Laden and others picked through the Quran and chose what would serve their purposes (sort of like what you're doing with Bible and Quran) but they often never finish what is stated in the text. The Quran states "slay enemies wherever you find them" (4:89) but also elaborates in the next verse, "Thus, if they let you be, and do not make war on you, and offer you peace, God does not allow you to harm them" (4:90). And the website you sent me too is a skewed and biased account of the crusades at best.

I'm sorry but you are wrong; it is agreed historical fact that the Crusades were a response to violent muslim encroachment on Christian territory. Muslims then took white Christians as slaves long before the famous enslavement of blacks happened. Muslims ARE STILL taking African slaves today, research the Arab Slave Trade. It is still happening! There are tons of violent verses in the Qu'ran but please quote to me a passage out of the NT (As we are comparing only Christianity and Islam here) where Christians are commanded to chop off heads, hands ect for God?

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm

I don't mean this in a disrespectful way (but maybe this is the only way you'll understand what I'm saying. You are like the girlfriend who f**ks a hundred guys and tells me that she only f**ked five. Everytime I confront you about another guy you f**ked, you say he doesn't count. You do not get to pick and choose your sexual history no more than you get to choose a religions history. You don't get to blatantly ignore the events that happened, not own up to them, and continuously recreate a biased and skewed version of what happened in the past. Even in the conversation with MikkiScorpion below you totally ignored the facts that he provided and simply refused to give any consideration to any view point that differs from your own. All religions have their share of violence and shameful actions when their words are twisted used to serve that individual's purpose. As a matter of fact, you fit the same criteria. You may not be sifting and picking through religious text to promote violence, but you are doing it to lay blame spread ignorance. If Islam has to live up to the standards that you've set forth, then Christianity must also stand up to those same standards. You don't get to rewrite history to suit your argument. This is what is fundamentally wrong with religious fundamentalist. And don't try to pull that "you must be a Muslim" shit either. I was raised in the Christian church. It's just that I don't disregard that Christians have perpetrated against others. The same way that I'm a combat veteran that for fought for America. I still don't close my eyes to the violence and atrocities that America has perpetrated against others. You, sir, are blinded by your faith; one of the most unchristian qualities that exist. Jesus would be ashamed of you.

How have I ignored the facts? I addressed your arguments; you just completely choose to ignore what I have said and you have wilfully blinded yourself to the true facts about Islam. My original point, which is fact, is that Islam is inherently a religion of violence and terror and that is the way it has always been propagated. I will say it again; it is accepted historical fact that the crusades were a response to Islamic Jihad in previous centuries. When did I disregard the fact that the witch hunts, Inquisition ect happened? I recall mentioning them quite clearly in my original response to you that although they were terrible, they are quite clearly contrary to the core teachings of Christianity. That means that it is not the ideology itself at fault, au contrare, Christianity has produced much good in the world for the evil perpetrated in its name. Universities, hospitals, charities and orphanages all came about as a result of Christian faith. The first Christians died for their beliefs. The first muslims killed and slaughtered for theirs. My argument was in the first place that Islam was inherently violent and you don't seem to understand that. In any case, you knew my opinion of Islam is based off facts when you came here to post so why attempt to insult me when the facts do not fit your worldview? You aren't going to change my opinion because my opinion is based off facts. You are blind to reality.

You're opinion isn't based on facts. It's based on a closed minded bigotry and junk history. And If I insulted you that wasn't my intent, but haven't you insulted my intelligence enough by presenting fiction and trying to convince me that it's fact? Your argument has no basis in reality. I feel sorry for you actually. Seeing through your eyes, the world must be a bleak and desolate place. May peace with you and Godspeed my friend.

You do not know anything about Christianity either then, it is a Christians duty to argue against any ideology that compares itself to Christianity (see 2 Corinthians 10:5) What is Islam if not a false and violent ideology contrary to what Christ teaches?

The violence done by Christians in the past is not really comparable to what muslims are doing these days for a number of reasons, however: We didn't know any better, science and technology was not around but when it did come around both Christianity and Judaism adapted to it fairly well. Muslims today, especially in Western countries, enjoy the good living conditions and opportunities of living in a civilised country but still hate our country and heritage. They also hate other Muslims if the conflicts between Shia and Sunni and the paltry giving of Zakat to other Muslim countries in need are anything to go by. They wilfully choose to live in ignorance and fly off to ISIS warzones despite being raised and given special treatment in white countries. There has been yet ANOTHER near-terrorist attack quite recently on a high speed train from Amsterdam to Paris. If it had not been for some brave US citizens there would have been more casualty's thanks to the vile teachings of Mohammed. I am only saying what I and the rest of the world sees as facts.
Muslims have always been this violent, quite consistently, throughout history, if you look into it properly. What they are doing today is no different than what they have been doing since Islam was founded.

You are a sad, pitiful, bigoted person. You are no different than an insane Imam who is spreading division and intolerance. People like you are the reason there is such a divide between people of different races, cultures and religions. I thought you were blinded by religion but it's clear you're no true Christian. You're no different than those Islamic radicals who preach hate and incite violence in their followers. The only difference is that no one has been pitiful enough to follow you.

Hahaha yeah whatever you say. You'll find out in the end like the rest of them.

As will you my friend. As will you.

For all those who deny Islam is violent at heart I advise you read this webpage, it explains everything better than I could: http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm