Two Buttons

The point isn't about who can and who cannot meme, the point is that murder is evil even if you cannot see your victims.

Would you feel the same if you were unvaxxed and spread that hoax virus to someone who died from it?

Actually I would feel very bad if I gave someone a virus that ended up killing them. I believe you are referring to the coronavirus virus outbreak, I supported the governments early efforts to control the spread and even said that mandatory vaccines may be the answer if the virus proved sufficiently dangerous. Just because someone holds a conservative view on abortion it does not mean that they are some sort of walking antivax stereotype. Nonetheless the difference between contaminating someone with an infectious disease and an issue like abortion is that the former is (presumably) involuntary, you (hopefully) do not chose t intentionally infect others with deadly pathogens. However the latter is intentional you are deliberately taking action in order to destroy human life.

Why do you want a society full of unloved unwanted unnurtured humans?

Because that is what it will become.
It's damn hard to raise a productive member of society WHEN that child IS wanted and many fail WHEN that child WAS wanted.

Virtually impossible when that child WASN'T WANTED

I don't want a society full of unwanted unnurtured human beings I greatly desire for all humans to have their rights and to be loved. Nonetheless, the sad reality of our world is that such a scenario is obviously impossible and you are correct that some children will grow up without the love and attention that they deserve. However I do not think that is a good argument in favor of abortion because it also applies to so many born people. For example the world is full of homeless people without anything to eat or even anywhere to sleep they are by all measurements unloved and unnurtured by society and yet I would still insist that they have human rights, human dignity and most importantly the right to life. Someone might suggest that murdering the homeless would be an efficient solution to their suffering, however such a suggestion would be morally unthinkable, it is true that the homeless are suffering but the answer to their suffering is not to murder them it is to help them as much as possible. A society does not determine a humans worth whether it be a homeless person, a baby in the womb, a Jewish person or anyone else for that matter, even if a society says that a person is worthless or unwanted it is not true because all humans have equal worth and dignity. When we find any person who has been crushed by society the answer is not to find a way to efficiently dispose of them instead the answer is to try to find a way to help them.

And you won't actually be banning abortions you will just be banning SAFE abortions.

The abortion pill makes all this pretty much moot anyway.

There are no safe abortions because there is always at least one victim. Goodbye.

Murder is not humane. Goodbye.

You don't want a society full of unwanted unloved unnurtured humans but that is exactly what will happen if you ban abortions.

Once again that is not a good argument for legalizing abortion. I don't want a society full of unwanted unloved unnurtured humans but that doesn't mean that we have the right to kill the homeless, the addicted, the immigrants, the widows the chronically poor, the orphans or the unborn. We have to put effort into helping all of these groups the answer is not to remorselessly exterminates them it is to find a way to help them, it may be hard but as human beings it is our moral duty.

Once again the more humane thing to do is to abort. Fact

Murder is not humane . Goodbye.

Why is Planned Parenthood only in the hood?

Pastor Dave Barnhart writes:

“The unborn” are a convenient group of people to advocate for. They never make demands of you; they are morally uncomplicated, unlike the incarcerated, addicted, or the chronically poor; they don’t resent your condescension or complain that you are not politically correct; unlike widows, they don’t ask you to question patriarchy; unlike orphans, they don’t need money, education, or childcare; unlike aliens, they don’t bring all that racial, cultural, and religious baggage that you dislike; they allow you to feel good about yourself without any work at creating or maintaining relationships; and when they are born, you can forget about them, because they cease to be unborn. It’s almost as if, by being born, they have died to you. You can love the unborn and advocate for them without substantially challenging your own wealth, power, or privilege, without re-imagining social structures, apologizing, or making reparations to anyone. They are, in short, the perfect people to love if you want to claim you love Jesus but actually dislike people who breathe.

Prisoners? Immigrants? The sick? The poor? Widows? Orphans? All the groups that are specifically mentioned in the Bible? They all get thrown under the bus for the unborn.

Why not advocate for the right of all people? Can you not advocate for prisoners, Immigrants, the sick, the poor, Widows, Orphans and the unborn why single the unborn out as the one group not to care about?

Because a fetus is NOT a baby.
A toddler isn't an adult.
A root beer isn't alcohol

Because a fetus is NOT a baby.

Of course a fetus is a baby just think about it logically, pregnant woman give birth to human babies so unless your arguing that the birth canal has some kind of magical property that turns none human entities into babies it is quite obvious that even in the womb a fetus is still a baby. You might be trying to argue that a fetus is technically different from a baby and while that is true this is really just an attempt to manipulate linguistics and it holds no relevance to the moral/biological question at the root of the argument. A fetus in the womb has the exact same DNA both pre and post birth, you can use a sonogram and see the fetus moving inside the womb, when a human fetus is born it is born as a human baby 100 times out of 100 the conclusion is obvious a fetus in the womb is a human baby.

A toddler isn't an adult.

True however they are both still human I hope that you would agree that it is wrong to murder a toddler just because it is at an earlier stage of life than an adult. The same logic applies to abortion a baby in the womb is a human the same as a child, a teenager and an adult they are all at different stages of life and development but they all share humanity.

A root beer isn't alcohol

I agree.

A fetus can murder the mother. A fetus is more important than the mother?

A fetus may be brain dead and die moments after a forced birth. Why force a woman to carry that to full term?

Why force a 10 yr old to birth their retarded uncle's seed?

It's a woman and her doctor's decision to make. NOBODY ELSE

A fetus can murder the mother. A fetus is more important than the mother?

A fetus cannot murder anyone because much like a newborn a fetus is below the age of reasoning, intention is a key element of murder a woman can murder her baby but a baby cannot murder anyone. The difference between murder and killing is that murder requires the intention to kill whereas killing is a term for someone who has caused an unintentional death, therefore it is impossible for a baby to murder anyone. I believe that what you meant to say is that carrying a baby to term can cause the death of a mother, and while that is true I am not saying that either the baby or the mother is more important. My entire argument is that they are of equal value and that murdering either of them would be wrong, this same sentiment applies to all people.

A fetus may be brain dead and die moments after a forced birth. Why force a woman to carry that to full term?

Because murdering people with brain damage is wrong I would be very careful if I were you because you are coming dangerously close to making an argument in favor of eugenics. Everyone has a right to live and being born with a medical condition does not waver that right, we should try to find ways to help/cure the sick we should not attempt to murder them.

Why force a 10 yr old to birth their retarded uncle's seed?

Despite the rather grotesque use of langue in this question I shall assume you are seriously enquiring and I shall answer anyway. Evil people do and have always existed we should hunt down all rapists and impression them until they die, however the issue of abortion ultimately comes back to the question of when does human life begin and do all humans deserve rights and protections. I would argue that every human has inherent, innate and irremovable rights and that the most important of these rights is the right to life, if we start arguing that some humans do not have rights because of the nature of their conception, their country of origin, their race, their sexuality we will begin to go down a very dark path. Everyone has human rights regardless of their background and the right to life is the most fundamental of all right.

It's a woman and her doctor's decision to make. NOBODY ELSE

Untrue if a woman and her doctor are planning to take the life of another person it is a matter that involves the state, the citizenry and indeed the world.

replying to damagedgoods

Actually now that I have had some time to think about it I should also point out that the bible does expressly say that we should try too prevent murder, so the man you are quoting is wrong the bible does directly speak on this issue. Nonetheless the argument you made was pretty terrible to begin with it was essentially that the suffering of some groups justifies the suffering of another, instead we should work towards eliminating the suffering of all groups.

on an unrelated note in my reply missed a question mark unfortunately I can not reedit it so I thought I would point out my mistake.

I see your problem.
The bible is a novel and is nonsense

Once again who is mentioning the bible? You were the one who posted a quote from a supposed pastor. As I said in my pervious comment if you are just going to start randomly insulting the bible it shows me that this is not a honest or open discussion and I think it would be best too end it before we just begin throwing insults at each other. Goodbye.

What your religious beliefs show me is you are incapable of changing your beliefs.

damgedgoods. The last argument you made that you made that I am wrong because I am wrong is not even an argument. You have also somehow stopped me from replying to your last comment which is why I am posting this here. I have not mentioned my beliefs in this exchange at all so by attacking them you contribute nothing. This discussion is a waste of both of our time so we should just end it goodbye hopefully for the last time.