I'm sorry, what now?

Washington Compost... go figure

Arizona is following suit... lol.

ACLU challenging freedom to choose......wow.

Unfortunate wording doesn't change the fact masks are better than no masks.

But what can I expect from the absolute carrot that thinks being a bottom of the barrel grammar cop, is a valid argument in a grown up discussion, and not the cringiest thing anybody has ever done, to try and get the upper hand in a discussion they've lost before it even begun.

You may suppose so, but the problem isn't masks vs masks here. The problem is people are trying to take away a choice over a flippin' piece of cloth or paper on face. You can mask up until the cows come home, I really don't care. Just don't force me to do it, and don't make it seem like choice is such a bad thing.

Their choice is a choice that puts other at risk, and their skepticism is based on lies.

Sorry but can't enjoy the advantages of civilized society while renouncing to its basic responsibilities.

I know what is is to do manual labor with a facemask in summer, you're a bunch of cry babies.

CDC is starting to lie, too, I suppose.

If you can be masked out in the hot sun, good for you. Not everybody is as privileged. And I thought advocating for choice is a part of civilized society, not some communist rathole.

The CDC has remained consistent about masks, and it's not gonna change just because skeptics try to pass every CDC's warning that they don't make you invincible as "definitive proof that the CDC says masks don't wok" which they've never stated as such, and if they did show me the quotation and I'll verify it.

It'd be the third time already.

"And I thought advocating for choice is a part of civilized society, not some communist rathole."

And I thought that freedom sometimes requires sacrifice, a kind of sacrifice this time, that feels like a walk in the park compared to the kinds of bellicose sacrifices for the military industrial complex that the radical right tends to advocate for.

Remember the Herculean sacrifice of wearing a mask the next time you try to justify police brutality because of the more than imaginary "Thin blue line" or watering the tree of freedom with the "blood of patriots and tyrants alike".

Here's a timeline for you, if you want to verify it for a fourth time: https://www.latimes.com/science/story/2021-07-27/timeline-cdc-mask-guidance-during-covid-19-pandemic.

Yes, freedom is a part of sacrifice, but it isn't a personal sacrifice if it's forced. If I decide to wear a mask because I feel it protects myself and/or others, then that is my own personal sacrifice. Why can't you make your own sacrifice for freedom when I'm not demanding anything of you? You, on the other hand, seem to be (by the way our conversations have been going) trying to coerce me into something I do no wish to do. What sacrifice is there on my end?

If I were to say no to mask mandates, your sacrifice would be personal (even if minimal). However, if you were to mandate wearing masks, you would be sacrificing my own freedom. If government "mandates" that I wear a mask due to shaky (at best) scientific tracking of a virus, that's government sacrificing my freedom. When said government doesn't believe its own mandates, it makes many people - myself included - believe that there is an ulterior motive to these mandates. I've had corona, probably twice, and a mask would not have stopped it either time. At the end of the day, a virus is going to do what a virus is going to do. This does not eliminate personal sympathy or empathy for people who have lost people to covid or a covid comorbidity.

I don't ever justify police brutality. That is also not a personal sacrifice. It is as evil as forcing people into submission.

TL;DR: The CDC is almost as inconsistent as the governing bodies who try to enforce laws and mandates based on their findings. Sacrifice is someone giving up a personal comfort, and does not include force from a government.

" but it isn't a personal sacrifice if it's forced"

We're still talking about a pandemic that affects everybody, caused by a virus that doesn't give a flying heck about your shallow understanding of personal sacrifice, meaning your personal sacrifice of being forced to wear a piece of cloth and get a harmless vaccine, asks more personal sacrifice from me, and those around you who don't want to either get sick, nor bury a loved one.

The lives of strangers (and not so strangers) are less important than your freedom to be comfortable, justifying it by any means necessary, just like a "grown up" version of this
66c3vw.jpg (click to show)

"At the end of the day, a virus is going to do what a virus is going to do. This does not eliminate personal sympathy or empathy for people who have lost people to covid or a covid comorbidity."

You're saying it yourself yet you still try to be a child and put opinions over facts.

"When said government doesn't believe its own mandates, it makes many people - myself included - believe that there is an ulterior motive to these mandat"

This is what happens when you allow opinions over facts, that's the exact problem right there making the CDC to be inconsistent, that when you don't need the CDC to know that masks reduce pathogen transmission enough for them to be used by surgeons and the food industry.

Like, bro, do you need the CDC to tell you to wipe your ass as well?

Yes, the pandemic impacts everyone. Hence, what I said about a virus doing what a virus is going to do.

If you're wearing a cloth mask and are vaccinated, you're likely not to become affected from unvaxxed, unmasked people. As chilling as it is that we are nearing 1 million deaths since the start of this pandemic, keep in mind that there have been nearly 80 million cases reported since the start. (https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#cases_casesper100k) Again, no disrespect to those who had to grieve, but we're doing pretty darn well, considering, hence why I see no reason to do either, nor do I see a reason to mandate for either. Also, over 215 million Americans - nearly 2/3 of our population - are fully vaccinated (based on the current CDC definition), meaning you're still very unlikely to even be affected by the virus, let alone be hospitalized -- at least for Covid.

Using actual facts to form an opinion is not being a baby. I'm breaking out here with some stats while you've got a generic baby stock photo, some stupid name-calling and bragging, all because I don't wish to wear a mask or force people to. Who's got the "opinions over facts" here?

"This is what happens when you allow opinions over facts, that's the exact problem right there making the CDC to be inconsistent, that when you don't need the CDC to know that masks reduce pathogen transmission enough for them to be used by surgeons and the food industry."

Opinions? Really? Why would these people who so breathlessly push masking, social distancing, and vaccinations not even follow their regulations? This is called analysis and critical thinking, not just creating a (childish) opinion.

And yes, but they don't use those cute little cloth masks, or even the blue ones. These are higher-quality masks that are made for such institutions.

Wear a mask, don't wear a mask, I don't care. Don't force people with mandates if these are completely effective.

Tell you what, you let me die of Covid (third time's a charm, right?), then you can dance, tinkle, and poop on my grave, all masked and vaxxed, and then you can wipe whatever parts you want, don't want, or whatever the CDC might tell you to wipe. M'kay?

Btw that link doesn't prove masks don't work, it only shows the struggle between wanting to do things properly, and having to at the same time, looking for whatever drop in the numbers to claim progress, only to realize you can't just do that, and then having to be more strict again.

No matter how you look at it, this is still an American Capitalism problem, grown up countries are better off precisely, because they don't do that kind of crap.

When our respective CDC's do something, they do it, and even in my country, where we got strong dissonances between territorial and national administrations, we've had, exemplar by comparison alone, application of safety measures and coordination between Autonomous Communities (quite similar like the States in the US, with Provinces instead of Counties) and the Central Government.

Grow up.

The point of the link was to show the CDC's inconsistency in their mask mandates / guidelines / recommendations / whatever you want to call them.

However, this might help out a bit, if you're looking for the effectiveness of masks: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9914969/Popular-blue-surgical-face-masks-NOT-stop-people-infected-COVID-19.html

With cloth masks being the least effective, and the most effective masks having a 50% elimination rate, again, I don't personally see a reason to mandate these things.

How in the world does capitalism play into a virus? If anything, you might want to say these mandates are caused by capitalism, because at some point, somebody's gotta be buying up these masks and shots in stock, not that capitalism causes resistance to mask mandates.

Ah, so you're not American. If it works in your country, whatever. We here in the Land of the Free are supposed to strive for as little government intervention as possible, as high governmental power turns often seems to turn sour for the people it's supposed to govern.

I'm grown. You're the only person in the world calling me a child. Or a carrot for that matter. (No, seriously, what the heck? I mean, I guess it's one way to call someone a vegetable, but come on.)

Good day.

The virus, as you put it, keeps doing it's thing.

And 50%, 40, or even 20% reduction in spread is worth a mandate, it's very little to nothing to ask, and prevents more pain than it causes some mild discomfort.

Literally first world problems over universal problems like a freaking pandemic.

But if Tommy Lee Jones isn't in a hazmat suit stopping a virus that f**king melts you in like hours, then it's nothing to be taken seriously.

The longer you take to put the mask on seriously, the longer you'll have this discussion, my country is lifting mandates safely at both the national and local levels, and my city has been mask free outdoors for more than a year now.

I'm just showing some empathy towards American folks by worrying about something that tho can affect me as well due to mutations caused by Americans wilfully turning themselves into "ChicoMerican" research labs on their own, specially with the habit of treating every single problem with a pill, which increases antiviral drug resistance, making them resistant to those drugs, forcing new vaccines.

I'm of course compelled by selfish self preservation, but what mostly moves me is that I don't want you to be a reckless loon, putting you and others in potential danger, because the only damage I want to cause on you is, if anything, intellectual growing pains.

I don't mind getting jabbed another couple times, the only thing that really worries me is some super variant that makes those jabs useless.

"I'm grown. You're the only person in the world calling me a child"

Maybe that's the problem, that not enough people are honest with you about it.