seasons greetings

And I'll remind you that the for-the-times liberal Republican party led the effort to crush the Democrat traitors and restore the Union to balance, as well as pass the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments to the Constitution and a Civil Rights Act 100 years before the Democrats finally caved and supported the Second Civil Rights Act.

Today's conservatives are the progressive liberals of the 19th century. Don't insult the intelligence of anyone who knows history by suggesting otherwise, because we all know that parties change.

confederates were conservatives, not liberals. the north was liberal.

Yes, and the values of the North would still be considered conservative today. Please keep your terminology accurate to the era about which you are speaking, because it confuses people who don't actually know history.

please stop insulting yesterday's conservative ideals with today's republican/qanon shit show.

LOL, so you’re allowed to make blatantly false generalizations with impunity? Sure. Keep digging your little hole.

90% of the acrimony comes from radical 10% of each side. Don’t insult the majority of either by judging them by that 10%z

this is tom cotton. https://imgflip.com/i/56z3vz

According to a BBC article I read (and I'm not taking sides here, just noting what I read), he said, "As the Founding Fathers said, it was the necessary evil upon which the union was built, but the union was built in a way, as [Abraham] Lincoln said, to put slavery on the course to its ultimate extinction."
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53550882

So...I get what he was trying to say (that the Union could never have been formed in the first place, because the South 100% refused to give up slavery if that was a condition of joining, so slavery was allowed to go on with the expectation that it would die out naturally*.)

Would I have worded it that way though? No. If tasked with conveying that sentiment I'd have said something like, "The regrettable fact is there would be no United States if the South had not been allowed to join despite being slavers. Extinction of that institution should have been our primary goal from the outset and the accomplishment of that outcome was the greatest moment in our history as a nation" (I feel this is much more representative of the state of affairs rather than trying to condense all that into the words, "necessary evil".)

*The cotton gin screwed that up massively.

Slavery was like eating meat - people can always choose not to, but they don't want to. The southern states joined the union because there was no strong opposition against slavery, the northern states simply chose not to have slaves. There was no contract guaranteeing it would continue or end. People simply changed their minds and decided to be slavery-vegetarian.

"No strong opposition against slavery" are you serious? There were plenty of people railing against slavery from the moment the Union was conceived.

https://thehill.com/changing-america/opinion/506782-anti-slavery-revolutionaries-who-practiced-what-they-preached

https://www.nps.gov/nr/travel/underground/antislav.htm

https://www.loc.gov/exhibits/african-american-odyssey/abolition.html

There was no contract stating it would end, yes, but that's because the economic realities were continually making it less and less profitable to own slaves...that is, until the cotton gin (invented long after the Union was established) suddenly made it lucrative and breathed fiery life into slavery again.

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aia/part3/3narr6.html

And to say that people, meekly "decided" to no longer own slaves is utterly ridiculous...it took a f*****g war fought by the North to violently overthrow military support of slavery in the South, and then the passage of the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments to quash it entirely. These were not hold-hands-and-sing-kumbaya times...they were the most acrimonious and violent in American history, and for good reason; nearly a century of often-violent disagreement as to how slavery should be treated in the U.S had led to that point. Various compromises had failed, people died in droves (ever heard of Bleeding Kansas?), and finally enough people got fed up with the pro-slavery movement that they settled the issue through force of arms.

i agree with that.

slavery is a choice when you live in a state that allows it. slavery was not forbidden to join the union.

I genuinely don't understand what you're trying to say...it wasn't banned outright because there would have been no union, and the founders placed more import on getting a nation built than ending slavery. Right, wrong, or indifferent, that's just how it happened. It led to the eventual reckoning a century later during the Civil War and first Civil Rights Movement.

the majority of conservatives voted for donald trump. the majority of conservatives who wanted to maintain slavery were in southern states. neither of those facts are generalizations.

Prove that a majority of conservatives voted for Donald Trump BECAUSE they thought he was racist.

In a two party system, people will swallow a LOT about a candidate if he checks more of their boxes than the other option. Therefore you cannot, in good conscience, even begin to make such a ridiculous assumption that conservatives voted for Trump because of his views on race.

And your second point has no bearing on the response I made. We weren't talking about the south in the 1870's anymore, as of then, so do try to keep up.

the republican party of trump IS a racist party that DOES fan the flames of "white victimhood" and "being replaced" by minorities. my second point IS about the meme you're commenting on.

Show me that on their official party platform...their website is accessible to all and it should then be VERY easy for you to prove that as being so. Since you decided quotes were relevant, I want you to show me where it uses phrases such as "White victimhood" and "being replaced" by minorities. These cannot be insinuations, but direct verbatim quotes.

Yes, it was relevant to the meme, but we had moved on from the time frame about which the meme was focused because you used the phrase, "today's republican/qanon s**t show".

there are extremes that attempt to hijack the base. today's republicans don't have slavery on their agenda, but once in a while, you get guys like tom cotton who admitted in 2018 slavery was a "necessary evil" who show their true colors.

but not because he was maintaining a conservative position? was he maintaining a liberal position?

I see the line of thinking you're following, but can tell you now it's flawed logic; Anyone who wants slavery to return, or at least defends it, IS adopting a conservative stance, but one SO conservative that it could not possibly have been something supported by Republicans, who were radical liberals when they burst onto the scene and fought slavery every step thence until its final death at the passage of the 2nd Civil Rights Act.

then why did republican tom cotton say "slavery was a necessary evil"?

Because he's a dumba**.

do you really think the republican party would admit openly it caters to such lowest common denominator stuff? only a few republicans dare to admit "slavery was a necessary evil". https://i.imgflip.com/56y6gc.jpg

No one admits it because no one thinks it. You are literally projecting your assumptions onto the entire party just because a few (pardon my French) retards infiltrated it in the 60's.

Look it up silly. We Will Not Be Replaced is only the newest white right wing battle cry OF victimhood. Do you know how to use google to do internet searches? https://www.google.com/search?q=do+whites+feel+victimized

No duh, of course there are folks on the right who think that...the FAR right. Since you failed to provide any proof that a fear of nonwhites or any other form of racism is an official Republican platform plank then I must point out that your claim that they are racist remains unsubstantiated. Attempting to deflect and reframe the argument as to the fact that some far-right folks are racist (which is absolutely true) is nothing but a smokescreen so you can avoid that little failure.

I didn't expect to really accomplish anything with this conversation anyways, but admit I'm a bit disappointed it wasn't more fruitful.

in the 50s and 60s conservative southern dixiecrats defected to the republican party when they saw the dems trying to pass civil rights.

That would be the 1960’s not the era of the civil war foolio. Your about 100 years off.

conservatives seceded. liberals defeated them.

Nope, states seceded. The federal government defeated them.

conservative states seceded. liberal federal government defeated them.

Nope there is no correlation between liberal and conservative in that context. As a matter of fact, those wanting to keep the Union whole would have been the conservatives and those wanting states to have the freedom to decide would have been liberal.

liberals wanted to own slaves? LOL

Your tiny mind can’t grasp that people thought differently 160 years ago. No one thought like a 2021 leftist then and yes the south was Democrats do yes they believed in the right to own slaves.

Until it was pointed out to me, I didn't know I had white privilege. I don't feel ashamed of myself, I wish it didn't exist. In china, people have chinese privilege. It's not just here, it's a majority bias and a minority suspicion.

Absolutely true, and who is further along on addressing equality. China?

yeah, i see what you're saying about classic liberalism and religious reasons against slavery, but there were also people who claimed their religious beliefs gave license TO maintain slaves. so...

Yes the 2860’s was a very different time and people had different beliefs and convictions. You can’t compare them to today’s social beliefs because today’s beliefs have evolved 160 years from then.

rooted in the same racism

Everyone during that period was North and South. The North wanted the federal government to ban slavery and the south said they didn’t have the right. They decided to fight and 500,000 white men died for the sin. Now you idiots want to fight it all
Over again.

yup, it took leftist agitators to make things equal. that's a compliment. the right wasn't going to do it. many blacks straighten their hair purely for professional jobs or because they want to fit into white society. either reason is based on racism, feeling excluded for racial reasons or self hate due to 400 years of oppression that hasn't quite ended yet.

The agitation is increasing the racism and expanding it. It is blatantly condoning racism against white people. Critical race theory convicts people based on skin color. That’s racism and you will never defeat racism with more racism. You will very simply increase racism.

why change the topic?

The topic was liberals in the civil war. I say there aren’t any of what you could Classify as liberals in 1860 USA.

so the people in 1860s america who said slavery was wrong were NOT liberals?

Nope. They were mostly against it due to religious beliefs that powered their objections. Current leftist dogma has nothing to do with classic
Liberalism that is steeped in the belief of individual freedom.

chinese racial genocide is not ok with me, it's ok with them.

china doesn't consider itself ethnically diverse or multicultural. america does. so china has no responsibility to be like us, but we have a lot of hypocrisy about it.

😂 so Chinese racial genocide is a ok by you. Who cares what they consider themselves. Talk about hypocrisy that is the ultimate in hypocrisy.

i don't understand what you mean about "you idiots want to fight it all over again". slavery didn't really end, look at the reconstruction voting rights and promised land rights taken away from blacks after sherman backed down. look at the jim crow laws that were blamed on blacks committing crime when they were really kept out of schools, jobs, etc and prevented from making a legal living. look at the sunset laws that were unofficially maintained into the 1970s. or the red lining that went on into the 1980s. and look at the racial profiling that exists in 2021 that looks for arrestable opportunities to meet quotas. and the natural hair hiring discrimination that makes blacks spend $$$ and time on toxic hair straightening. slavery is america's original sin, and it has not been acknowledged or fully repaired yet.

Slavery absolutely ended in the United States shortly after the defeat of the Confederacy. Equality was not instantaneous. The United States didn’t invent slavery. Blacks and Arabs in Africa have traded slaves since before Jesus. I don’t see any blacks people that have to straighten their hair anywhere I’ve worked. These are tropes the left sells from the 60’s. Prejudice is common and exists in every person. For some it’s not color or ethnicity it’s fat, tall, short, ugly, clothes or any other trait that makes them think poorly of someone else. You are buying a lie. America is not as racist as you think and certainly not as prejudiced as it used to be, but it is increasing rather than decreasing thanks to leftist agitators and useful idiots.

1960s racists left the dem party over civil rights and joined the republican party.

That has nothing to do with the civil war

is this guy a leftist? https://i.imgflip.com/56y6gc.jpg

what we can compare are people's willingness to allow slavery to continue to today's willingness to do nothing about remnant racism.

Where and in what way is it legally Condoned in America?

racism is absolutely condoned by racial profiling and the militarized police to fight conservatives racist, failed drug war.

Doesn't mean you need to throw the entire conservative movement under the bus. We don't like racism either.

like 99% of memes in politics stream about democrats?