Kill Yourself Guy

I makes perfect sense if you understand what atheists believe.

Thanks for asking. If atheism is true then no one created everything out of nothing for no reason. Sorry, but it seems mre reasonable that someone created everything out of nothing for a reason. Therefore atheism requires more faith than theism.

Thanks for your response. Atheism IS a claim and makes claims just like theism. The atheistic claim is a belief that GOD DOES NOT EXIST. Since I only addressed the "reasonablness" of the two possibilities then it is you who have committed the straw man fallacy by making assumptions about things which I have not agrued for - yet.

Everything which begins to exist has a cause. The universe had a beginning. Therefore the universe has a cause. Because the universe consists of TIME , SPACE and MATTER then the cause would have to be TIMELESS(because it created time) SPACELESS(because it created all of this space) and IMMATERIAL(it created the material universe). This has the charachteristics of what we call God. So,I am not simply agruing from the lack of evidence but from the evidence. The evidence leads to an all powerful, spaceless, timeless immaterial being.

The more we advance scientifically the more unlikely that atheism is true. There is a superintellect behind the universe. The discovery of the DNA code is another piece of evidence as in all of our known experiance - codes come from minds.

The great Einstein wanted to know how God did it but we can absolutely see the signs of intelligence in all of creation. So, regarding your last questions and statements - for the purpose of this conversation, I have made a positive argument, it's not lazy and I can narrow down to which God but for now I think I have answered the question as to which is more reasonable. Codes don't just happen and neither does anything happen without a reason. Since the Bible has never been proven false then I defend Yahweh.

You can call it whatever you want or say it’s tweaked but I presented a valid argument with a conclusion which follows. If it’s flawed then please point out which premise is flawed. So far you have not done so. The argument does not make the claim a creator without a beginning but it is a philosophical conclusion based not only on the Kalam argument but on Einstein’s discovery which is that time, space and matter has a beginning and are related. Big Bang Cosmology states that these three came into being at a definite moment. Well, it stands to reason that whomever created time is not bound by time. So, it is reasonable to assume that the creator is TIMELESS. In the beginning, there was no time, no space and no matter. Furthermore it was argued for centuries by a lot of atheist that the universe was eternal. Now that we know that it isn’t then something has to be eternal – because as you stated – we cannot have an infinite regress. This is not case of special pleading at all. It is simply following the evidence to where it leads – as I have already pointed out. Either the universe is eternal or something outside of it is. Well, it ain’t the universe. If the universe had abeginning then it had to have a BEGINNER. Something or someone had to set the whole show off as opposed to nothing setting it off. The Bible absolutely demonstrates that there is one true God and it is the one described in the pages of the Bible. You are correct in that the Cosmological argument I gave doesn’t get us to the God of the Bible specifically but it narrows the field down to Him and Allah. Are you saying that minds don’t exist? Humans need brains but we also have minds and our mind is immaterial. Jesus of Nazareth demonstrated that He was divine by His being able to control nature, His supreme wisdom, ability to perform miracles, predicting and accomplishing His resurrection from the dead, leading a morally perfect life and telling the future – and fulfilling ancient prophesies. He spoke of spirits, angels, demons, Heaven and Hell and because He never told a lie then these things exists. If DNA is not a code you should tell this to the scientists because in just about every discussion on the subject, it is referred to as a CODE. But let’s say that “IT CODES”. Well, how did it know to code? Bill Gates said of DNA that it is like a software but far more complex than anything that Microsoft could come up with

"Matter and energy appear to be eternal." It isn't.
“With the proof now in place, cosmologists can no longer hide behind the possibility of a past-eternal universe. There is now no escape, they have to face the problem of a cosmic beginning.” Alexander Vilenkin
Arno Penzias – “The best data we have (concerning the Big Bang) are exactly what I would have predicted had I had nothing to go on but the five books of Moses, the Psalms and the Bible as a whole.”
Robert Wilson – “Certainly there was something that set it all off.... I can’t think of a better theory of the origin of the universe to match Genesis.”
George Smoot – “There is no doubt that a parallel exists between the big bang as an event and the Christian notion of creation from nothing.”

I'm sorry that I lack the time to go over thinwith you in detail but the I think you know that the quotes are not from theologians. We know that there is intelligence behind the universe because it is so finely tuned for life. There is not a chance that chance is the cause. Too many variable which if they were changed to the slightest degree would destroy us and our system. The Bible is a collection of books and many are eyewitness accounts which makes them authorative. That is not circular. Furthermore, there are also extra-Biblical accounts of the New Testament. While it is not part of this conversation, The Quran is easily proven false and contradicts itself while the Bible does not. There is also archaeological evidence which supports scripture. Thanks for the conversation though.

There are only a couple of dieties described as spaceless, timeless, immaterial and all powerful. There are a lot of mythical and man made gods but there aren't thousands of ones who could be The One. Your own intelligence is immaterial, so do you not believe in your own intelligence? You cannot touch it or taste it and yet, you have it.

There is plenty of evidence outside of the Bible. The NT alone cites more thn 30 people confirmed by secular sources or archaeology. There are 10 ancient non Christian sources including: Historians: Josephus, Tacitus, Suetonius, Thallus, Phlegon -Government Officials: Pliny the Younger, Emperor Trajan, Emperor Hadrian -Other Sources including The Jewish Talmud and Greek writer Lucian. When one combines what they all wrote, none contrdicts the NT.

Jesus proved His divinity and it was puntuated with His resurrection. Men did follow him around for 3 years - night and day and it was said that even His enemies couldn't find a lie in Him. Neither you or I could live under such scrutinity and have someone say this about us. There is an embarassment of riches when it comes to evidence of the Bible. BTW, 40 different author wrote it so that also takes away your "circular reasoning" claim. The book of Acts has 84 actual archaelogically confirmed details right down to the depth of the waters. I'll leave you with this:“I began with a mind unfavorable to it [Acts]….;but more recently I found myself brought into contact with the book of Acts as an authority for the topography, antiquities, and society of Asia Minor. It was gradually borne in upon me that in various details the narrative showed marvelous truth.”
(Archaeologist William Ramsey, St. Paul the Traveler and Roman Citizen, p. 8)